That's quite a bit of historical revision. Those were not anti-war narratives, those were pro-war narratives. And I was opposed to our adventure to reshape the ME.
In Ukraine, there is no such "anti-war" (read pro-war) narrative. No one is trying to remake Ukraine, other than pro-war Russia.
I'm not worried about Ukraine only. Of course I do have concern but this issue is much bigger than Ukraine. It involves Moldova, the Baltics, possible the Kazakhstan and maybe Poland.
Wait a minute. We don't even trust elections in the US and now we are going to trust one by Russia in a country they have eyes on, while it is under military occupation?
The presence of those polite little green men.. kinda throws the whole idea of a free and fair election out the window doesn't it?
I disagree. I think our interests are to avoid a series of imperial wars that could possibly drag us and our allies into a direct confrontation. Recall.. this isn't just about Ukraine. This is about Russia seeking to reestablish a geographic buffer zone which essentially means reinventing the USSR.
I get it.
Things you disagree with are "revisionist." What neo cons believe about the ChiCom threat to the rest of the world is "revisionist." The fact that they use the same tortured rationalizations you do is invisible to you because of your cognitive dissonance. (Not a dig, a real observation on what you're displaying.)
Your *belief* that Russia is poised to sweep thru Europe tho, that's based on an accurate read of the current geopolitical situation. /giggle
You also seem to be attempting to apply a little revisionist magic to this thread in real time. That map I shared is the 2010 elections that later led to the coup which replaced the victor in those elections. I don't know what you thought I meant by "this was the last election the people of Eastern Ukraine were allowed to participate in" meant. But I think it was very clear when I pointed out the reason they haven't been able to vote since is they've been under siege by Western Ukraine since those results. Those aren't Russia's election results. Those are the same Ukrainian election results Western officials use to claim "Ukraine" is pro West.
More when I have time. Much ... much ... more.
Queshank
I've lost the plot on whatever we are discussing regarding China. I am seeing something about sharing tortured rationalizations. Spell it out for me like we are in a discussion bc I am not tracking you. Imagine me being a little slower than most. Walk me through it.
I don't have a belief that Russia will sweep through Europe, I have a belief that they have eyes on other nations in their neighborhood (one would need to be stupid not to agree) and that this could turn into a war that sucks in our European allies, and should be avoided if possible.
Recall, I am also making an anti-war argument, I'm just against more wars than you are.
Oh ok, we were talking about different elections. I thought you were running on the argument that Crimea voted for this. My bad!
But there is something else for me to push back on, this notion that Ukraine voting out the Russian means that that east is under siege. When one side loses an election, that doesn't mean they are under siege. That means they lost.
And this notion that the US has staged a coup hasn't ever been successfully established in my eyes.
You know what would help these conversations move in a more clean and coordinated way? I would recommend being more specific. Less vague-booking.
Things you disagree with are "revisionist." What neo cons believe about the ChiCom threat to the rest of the world is "revisionist." The fact that they use the same tortured rationalizations you do is invisible to you because of your cognitive dissonance. (Not a dig, a real observation on what you're displaying.)
Your *belief* that Russia is poised to sweep thru Europe tho, that's based on an accurate read of the current geopolitical situation. /giggle
You also seem to be attempting to apply a little revisionist magic to this thread in real time. That map I shared is the 2010 elections that later led to the coup which replaced the victor in those elections. I don't know what you thought I meant by "this was the last election the people of Eastern Ukraine were allowed to participate in" meant. But I think it was very clear when I pointed out the reason they haven't been able to vote since is they've been under siege by Western Ukraine since those results. Those aren't Russia's election results. Those are the same Ukrainian election results Western officials use to claim "Ukraine" is pro West.
More when I have time. Much ... much ... more.
Queshank
I've lost the plot on whatever we are discussing regarding China. I am seeing something about sharing tortured rationalizations. Spell it out for me like we are in a discussion bc I am not tracking you. Imagine me being a little slower than most. Walk me through it.
I don't have a belief that Russia will sweep through Europe, I have a belief that they have eyes on other nations in their neighborhood (one would need to be stupid not to agree) and that this could turn into a war that sucks in our European allies, and should be avoided if possible.
Recall, I am also making an anti-war argument, I'm just against more wars than you are.
Oh ok, we were talking about different elections. I thought you were running on the argument that Crimea voted for this. My bad!
But there is something else for me to push back on, this notion that Ukraine voting out the Russian means that that east is under siege. When one side loses an election, that doesn't mean they are under siege. That means they lost.
And this notion that the US has staged a coup hasn't ever been successfully established in my eyes.
You know what would help these conversations move in a more clean and coordinated way? I would recommend being more specific. Less vague-booking.
I'm sorry but you seem to be woefully uninformed on this issue that's been in development for about 25 years.
You see my statements as vague because you're under educated. As I pointed out before ... you have a *lot* to catch up on.
Now I would normally say it's your programming getting in the way of your understanding. And it would be an accurate statement here as well. Because you seem unable to understand that it is Western Ukraine that besieged Eastern Ukraine starting in February of 2014. And that Eastern Ukraine was under seige and there are zero election results from the territories ever since. (Except those easy to disregard ones that Russia produced. But then we need to consider that the separatists started in Eastern Ukraine ... not Russia.)
Perhaps instead of me giving you a few 401 level courses on the subject you could crack into it a bit rather than jumping in with your gradeschool primer? (bazinga! I gotta keep it fresh y'know?)
You can get started here tho probly. The "deleted" is me. In Dec when my mother started the process of dying I deleted the account so I wouldn't be tempted to just come and insult friends to relieve stress.
I'm not sure if I explained for the boards how Russia's entire existence is predicated on oil pipelines that the USSR built thru Ukraine and that Russia would have lost access to if the Western companies like Shell and BP that were given contracts to exploit the oil and gas deposits were allowed to continue. (Do you need links to news articles about Shell and BP pulling out of the contracts? Or are you educated on the subject of Ukraine?)
But if not I'll find one of the other dozens of threads where the issue was explained and fleshed out since for you to catch up on.
It's pretty much obvious where you see "vagueness" is gaps in your own understanding that need to be rectified before we can even have a conversation.
I'm not worried about Ukraine only. Of course I do have concern but this issue is much bigger than Ukraine. It involves Moldova, the Baltics, possible the Kazakhstan and maybe Poland.
Russia's had troops in Transnistria in Moldova since 1992, but now that's a concern? If Russia/Putin is trying to reform the Soviet Union, wouldn't that have been the first place to be concerned about long before Ukraine in 2022?
It might've involved the Baltics if they hadn't joined NATO, or alternatively come to an accommodation with Russia a la Kazakhstan regarding its Russian minority (and is also run by oligarchs that have been willing to work with Russia).
Probably wouldn't have involved Poland since there was no significant Russian minority to use as leverage (which didn't change Polish fears about Russia and why they sought NATO membership).
US weapons could start arriving in Ukraine within days, but it still has a major problem that aid can't fix
The release of a $61 billion aid bill by the US Senate on Tuesday is a massive boost to Ukraine in its battle against Russia's invasion. According to The New York Times, US weapons could start arriving in Ukraine within days. But on parts of the front line, Ukraine's situation is desperate. And it still has a major problem that aid can't fix: a lack of troops. "The most important source of Ukrainian weakness is the lack of manpower," Konrad Muzyka, director of the Rochan military consultancy in Poland, told Reuters...
Oh my. You haven't been paying attention to anything that's been happening in Ukraine since Oct 7 have you?
It's not been good.
We shouldn't be burdening our future generations with -more- debt. I know you old leftists don't have a problem with that as ya'll be passing away soon enough but it's fucked up what you're doing. The elderly population is supposed to look out for and guide the younger generations, not burden them excessive debt and poverty because of your own greed and selfishness.
Fucking boomers, most worthless generation that the US has ever produced.
OK, Groomer.
Remember, Groomer, you failed at an eighth-grade job.
Lol@ the projection. -YOU- were the one that got your ass kicked and lost half your brain. Not I.
Reply #48 Post by thecitizen
"Men usually don’t report rape. Many young boys don’t report it because they like it. "
"...it's my guess that continuing the adoption of masks, social distancing, and even lockdowns will be vital in preserving the human race against covid."
Remember, Groomer, you failed at an eighth-grade job.
Lol@ the projection. -YOU- were the one that got your ass kicked and lost half your brain. Not I.
You might have had the opportunity.....had you left the FOB. Loggies don't really do that now though, eh? Naw, you were too busy fucking up and making Marines go without due to your incompetence.
Lol@ the projection. -YOU- were the one that got your ass kicked and lost half your brain. Not I.
You might have had the opportunity.....had you left the FOB. Loggies don't really do that now though, eh? Naw, you were too busy fucking up and making Marines go without due to your incompetence.
The 0300 Jarheads kicked your ass, didn't they?
LMAO. Once again trying to project your failure onto me.
You would have an intact brain if you weren't a dumbass.
Reply #48 Post by thecitizen
"Men usually don’t report rape. Many young boys don’t report it because they like it. "
"...it's my guess that continuing the adoption of masks, social distancing, and even lockdowns will be vital in preserving the human race against covid."