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Post by rabbitreborn on Jun 29, 2020 0:06:59 GMT
The mask is a preventative measure for spreading the flu as well. I’m sure you and all the other scared Karens always wore masks during flu season before, right?
Please document the lethality of the flu vs. Covid-19, including details on various age groups.
Then please document the preventative measures for each, including vaccines.
You’re talking about a “deadly virus”. Now you want to talk numbers of how many die? How can you be so cold to the tens of thousands of Americans who die from the flu? What, they don’t matter? You fucking monster. You despicable monster who doesn’t care about people dying. I know people who have died from the flu. Stay the fuck inside you monster!
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Post by Lomelis on Jun 29, 2020 0:13:34 GMT
Flattening the curve by shutting everything down and crashing the economy is a display of irrational fear. Recognizing that the giving those same people that did that or support that even more power on a national level would be even more of a disaster is not irrational. Not if it's temporary. Yes, it is. Temporary or not is irrelevant. There were numerous other means of flattening the curve that did not require such invasive self inflicted damage. Voluntary social distancing and mask usage. More resources towards cleaning up the nurse homes and isolating the sick and elderly at hospitals. Not panic, shutdowns, rights violations, and lies.
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Odysseus
Legend
Trump = Disaster
Posts: 41,097
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Post by Odysseus on Jun 29, 2020 0:49:37 GMT
Please document the lethality of the flu vs. Covid-19, including details on various age groups.
Then please document the preventative measures for each, including vaccines.
You’re talking about a “deadly virus”. Now you want to talk numbers of how many die? How can you be so cold to the tens of thousands of Americans who die from the flu? What, they don’t matter? You fucking monster. You despicable monster who doesn’t care about people dying. I know people who have died from the flu. Stay the fuck inside you monster! You're cruisin' close to the edge, buddy.
Your point is nugatory because of your past insistence on facts and figures. When challenged to provide your own, you retreat into insults, deflection, and cowardice.
I'll ask again, differently: what is the death rate from Covid-19 vs. Influenza, today?
What vaccines exist to protect people against Covid-19?
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Post by Lomelis on Jun 29, 2020 1:00:19 GMT
You’re talking about a “deadly virus”. Now you want to talk numbers of how many die? How can you be so cold to the tens of thousands of Americans who die from the flu? What, they don’t matter? You fucking monster. You despicable monster who doesn’t care about people dying. I know people who have died from the flu. Stay the fuck inside you monster! You're cruisin' close to the edge, buddy.
Your point is nugatory because of your past insistence on facts and figures. When challenged to provide your own, you retreat into insults, deflection, and cowardice.
I'll ask again, differently: what is the death rate from Covid-19 vs. Influenza, today?
What vaccines exist to protect people against Covid-19?
So you're saying that because the flu has a vaccine that kind of works and that the death rate is lower, that's it ok to go out and infect people where they could potentially die?
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Odysseus
Legend
Trump = Disaster
Posts: 41,097
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Post by Odysseus on Jun 29, 2020 1:03:51 GMT
You're cruisin' close to the edge, buddy.
Your point is nugatory because of your past insistence on facts and figures. When challenged to provide your own, you retreat into insults, deflection, and cowardice.
I'll ask again, differently: what is the death rate from Covid-19 vs. Influenza, today?
What vaccines exist to protect people against Covid-19?
So you're saying that because the flu has a vaccine that kind of works and that the death rate is lower, that's it ok to go out and infect people where they could potentially die?
If that's what I meant, I would have said it.
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Post by Lomelis on Jun 29, 2020 1:05:39 GMT
You're cruisin' close to the edge, buddy.
Your point is nugatory because of your past insistence on facts and figures. When challenged to provide your own, you retreat into insults, deflection, and cowardice.
I'll ask again, differently: what is the death rate from Covid-19 vs. Influenza, today?
What vaccines exist to protect people against Covid-19?
So you're saying that because the flu has a vaccine that kind of works and that the death rate is lower, that's it ok to go out and infect people where they could potentially die? Ok, so then you're saying that it's not ok but you do it anyways?
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Odysseus
Legend
Trump = Disaster
Posts: 41,097
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Post by Odysseus on Jun 29, 2020 1:06:46 GMT
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Odysseus
Legend
Trump = Disaster
Posts: 41,097
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Post by Odysseus on Jun 29, 2020 1:10:18 GMT
The BIG difference between influenza and Covid-19: There are annual vaccines against influenza. There is currently NO vaccine against Covid-19.
I don't know why this simple fact is so hard for some to grasp.
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Post by Mercy for All on Jun 29, 2020 1:10:29 GMT
Because all business owners are super rich, right? It doesn’t harm entrepreneurship to just shut things down? And guess what? Governments still demanded property taxes on commercial property at the same rate as always, despite shutting down businesses. Ask me how I know. So...not temporary? For the sake of argument, what if lockdown was one day? Is that "weatherable"? If so, then where is the line at which lockdown becomes "too long"?
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Post by Mercy for All on Jun 29, 2020 1:13:14 GMT
You're not suggesting it's going to be permanent, are you? Consider that Canada is beginning to open up--to different degrees in different provinces. Yesterdays new case numbers for Canada were 218. Not 2,180. 218. For the entire country. Population over 36 million. More spread out? Maybe, but something like 99% of the population lives within 100 miles of the U.S. border, and Toronto is the fourth largest metropolitan centre in North America (with Mexico City being by far the largest). So...yeah...it could be temporary.
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Post by Mercy for All on Jun 29, 2020 1:14:15 GMT
Yes, it is. Temporary or not is irrelevant. There were numerous other means of flattening the curve that did not require such invasive self inflicted damage. Voluntary social distancing and mask usage. More resources towards cleaning up the nurse homes and isolating the sick and elderly at hospitals. Not panic, shutdowns, rights violations, and lies. Do you have examples of any of these other means that were tried successfully?
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Post by jasmine on Jun 29, 2020 1:20:17 GMT
You're not suggesting it's going to be permanent, are you? Consider that Canada is beginning to open up--to different degrees in different provinces. Yesterdays new case numbers for Canada were 218. Not 2,180. 218. For the entire country. Population over 36 million. More spread out? Maybe, but something like 99% of the population lives within 100 miles of the U.S. border, and Toronto is the fourth largest metropolitan centre in North America (with Mexico City being by far the largest). So...yeah...it could be temporary. I’m suggesting that I don’t trust government. It likes to introduce temporary policies that wind up becoming permanent.
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Post by Lomelis on Jun 29, 2020 1:25:53 GMT
Yes, it is. Temporary or not is irrelevant. There were numerous other means of flattening the curve that did not require such invasive self inflicted damage. Voluntary social distancing and mask usage. More resources towards cleaning up the nurse homes and isolating the sick and elderly at hospitals. Not panic, shutdowns, rights violations, and lies. Do you have examples of any of these other means that were tried successfully? The most well known example is probably Sweden. Their results were about as good as ours without all the social chaos. They also failed to protect the nursing homes, which they acknowledged, and in May nearly 50% of covid related deaths there happened in these "care homes". www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-52704836
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Odysseus
Legend
Trump = Disaster
Posts: 41,097
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Post by Odysseus on Jun 29, 2020 1:33:52 GMT
Do you have examples of any of these other means that were tried successfully? The most well known example is probably Sweden. Their results were about as good as ours without all the social chaos. They also failed to protect the nursing homes, which they acknowledged, and in May nearly 50% of covid related deaths there happened in these "care homes". www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-52704836
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Odysseus
Legend
Trump = Disaster
Posts: 41,097
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Post by Odysseus on Jun 29, 2020 1:35:39 GMT
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Odysseus
Legend
Trump = Disaster
Posts: 41,097
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Post by Odysseus on Jun 29, 2020 1:37:10 GMT
And finally, the results in the USA are nothing to brag about. They are so bad that the EU is very close to banning travel to its member nations by people from the USA.
Nice going, Trumpists!
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Post by Lomelis on Jun 29, 2020 4:54:48 GMT
The most well known example is probably Sweden. Their results were about as good as ours without all the social chaos. They also failed to protect the nursing homes, which they acknowledged, and in May nearly 50% of covid related deaths there happened in these "care homes". www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-52704836That doesn't counter anything I've said. Their results have been about the same as anybody else. Italy, Spain, and UK all did worse then them and they all did the full lock down thing, much stricter than ours.
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Post by rabbitreborn on Jun 29, 2020 8:08:44 GMT
You’re talking about a “deadly virus”. Now you want to talk numbers of how many die? How can you be so cold to the tens of thousands of Americans who die from the flu? What, they don’t matter? You fucking monster. You despicable monster who doesn’t care about people dying. I know people who have died from the flu. Stay the fuck inside you monster! You're cruisin' close to the edge, buddy.
Your point is nugatory because of your past insistence on facts and figures. When challenged to provide your own, you retreat into insults, deflection, and cowardice.
I'll ask again, differently: what is the death rate from Covid-19 vs. Influenza, today?
What vaccines exist to protect people against Covid-19?
Covid seems more deadly than the flu. We don’t know the denominator on lethality, so it’s hard to say for certain. Nobody, including the CDC, knows with any certainty. But we know it’s dropping. And we’ll know more as time moves forward. But to perch yourself onto a shelf of moral righteousness and shed your tears for every life lost, I feel it is both necessary and obvious to ask you the following questions. 1. Have you ever left your house with the flu? 2. Is the flu deadly? Does it ever kill people? Thousands of people? 3. Were the George Floyd protests selfish and terrible? Did you denounce them? If not, why? Because the purpose was noble and worth the sacrifice of people’s lives?
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Post by rabbitreborn on Jun 29, 2020 8:11:41 GMT
The BIG difference between influenza and Covid-19: There are annual vaccines against influenza. There is currently NO vaccine against Covid-19.
I don't know why this simple fact is so hard for some to grasp.
You hold your fear as a virtue, and bemoan the loss of life from Covid, but excuse the loss of life from the flu because there is a vaccine. Do people die from the flu? If the answer is yes, and I think it is, it destroys your thin veneer of righteous superiority. Sorry. Sorry about that stroke-inducing cognitive dissonance you’re suffering.
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Post by rabbitreborn on Jun 29, 2020 8:14:42 GMT
And finally, the results in the USA are nothing to brag about. They are so bad that the EU is very close to banning travel to its member nations by people from the USA.
Nice going, Trumpists!
Belgium, Italy, UK, Sweden, Spain, and France all have a higher death per million rate than the US. Those countries all tried to address it differently. Heavy lockdowns to much lighter lockdowns. But they’ve got it all figured out? What’s important here? Is it deaths? Because that’s what you’re harping on. Yet you look to Europe for answers?
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