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Post by Mercy for All on May 3, 2021 14:19:16 GMT
Quotes, man, quotes! Shouldn't be difficult. Was hoping you knew the theory of evolution good enough to save me the time in quotes. Besides, I recall already posting numerous articles and videos on one of these topics refuting your ignorance. In the end the research is up to you. I'm not gonna do your research for you. I do not have time to entertain intellectual cowards nor will I. You are either honest with yourself or you're not. You are either honest with others or you're not. I don't debate philosophy as I have abandoned philosophy completely. I know in the end that you will either be honest or you won't be. I'm not gonna philosophize with your nonsense. No. I know the theory well enough to know that it doesn't say what you say it says. You have posted numerous articles and videos and in not in a single one of those does a scientist say that "evolution began with the Big Bang" or that "evolution explains abiogenesis." Provide a direct quote. About exactly that. |
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Post by Mercy for All on May 3, 2021 14:20:15 GMT
 And the liar declares another to be a unChristian. Tell us fool, where does the Bible oppose evolution? "Many believe that before Darwin published The Origin of Species in 1859, Christians as a whole maintained an entirely literal, six-day interpretation of Genesis in which the earth was only a few thousand years old. In fact, however, the idea of an old earth had already become increasingly popular among Christians throughout the half century leading up to The Origin of Species.1
Another misconception is that the arrival of Darwin’s theory led the scientific and theological communities to immediately take up positions opposing each other. But history reveals that one of the earliest supporters of evolutionary theory in the American scientific community was a devout Christian botanist named Asa Gray. And among theologians, BB Warfield—an architect of the contemporary evangelical understanding of biblical inerrancy—believed that certain forms of evolution were also compatible with a high view of Scripture.
The First Christian Response to Origin of Species in America
Darwin did not invent the idea of evolution. By the time The Origin of Species was published, the idea of evolution in many natural processes was already popular, and the term development was used in its place for discussions of society’s change or the history of the solar system.2 What’s more, it was widely accepted that the earth was much older than previously thought. Most of the groundwork for this understanding resulted from geological work done earlier that century. Through meticulous study of the fossil record, naturalists helped spread the view that the earth was old rather than young.
Though many people like to focus on Christian hostility to evolutionary theory, a careful look at history reveals some surprising facts. For instance, the first American scientist to carefully review and publicly support Darwin’s Origin of Species was a devout Christian named Asa Gray, now regarded as one of the most prominent American biologists of the 19th century. A shy person who avoided politics, Gray worked quietly and does not have the same name recognition as scientists like Louis Agassiz and T.H. Huxley—both flamboyant self-promoters who provoked public debate. But, his brilliant research during his 30-year career at Harvard University helped usher in the era of modern biology in the United States." Genesis 1:1 for starters: In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. Evolution is an uncreated universe. Wrong. Evolution says nothing about the origins of the materials involved in the process of evolution. Absolutely nothing whatsoever. The Bible says God created everything. Doesn't say how. |
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Post by oldtrapper on May 3, 2021 20:25:47 GMT
And the liar declares another to be a unChristian. Tell us fool, where does the Bible oppose evolution?
"Many believe that before Darwin published The Origin of Species in 1859, Christians as a whole maintained an entirely literal, six-day interpretation of Genesis in which the earth was only a few thousand years old. In fact, however, the idea of an old earth had already become increasingly popular among Christians throughout the half century leading up to The Origin of Species.1
Another misconception is that the arrival of Darwin’s theory led the scientific and theological communities to immediately take up positions opposing each other. But history reveals that one of the earliest supporters of evolutionary theory in the American scientific community was a devout Christian botanist named Asa Gray. And among theologians, BB Warfield—an architect of the contemporary evangelical understanding of biblical inerrancy—believed that certain forms of evolution were also compatible with a high view of Scripture.
The First Christian Response to Origin of Species in America
Darwin did not invent the idea of evolution. By the time The Origin of Species was published, the idea of evolution in many natural processes was already popular, and the term development was used in its place for discussions of society’s change or the history of the solar system.2 What’s more, it was widely accepted that the earth was much older than previously thought. Most of the groundwork for this understanding resulted from geological work done earlier that century. Through meticulous study of the fossil record, naturalists helped spread the view that the earth was old rather than young.
Though many people like to focus on Christian hostility to evolutionary theory, a careful look at history reveals some surprising facts. For instance, the first American scientist to carefully review and publicly support Darwin’s Origin of Species was a devout Christian named Asa Gray, now regarded as one of the most prominent American biologists of the 19th century. A shy person who avoided politics, Gray worked quietly and does not have the same name recognition as scientists like Louis Agassiz and T.H. Huxley—both flamboyant self-promoters who provoked public debate. But, his brilliant research during his 30-year career at Harvard University helped usher in the era of modern biology in the United States."
Genesis 1:1 for starters: In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. Evolution is an uncreated universe. It might be necessary here to inform you that all the early church fathers very strongly opposed Darwin's theory of evolution well over 1000 years before Darwin was born. In the link below you'll see a 2nd century Christian theologian reject evolution theory. libertynewsforum.boards.net/post/61836/threadRoman's 1:18-32 and 2Peter 3:3-7 are also two passages that prophesy against evolution theory. In the Apocrypha you can read the first three chapters of Wisdom and that refutes the atheist view as well. None of the scriptures you refer to speak to the evolution theory. They speak only to the creation of the earth as a beginning, not as an end. And even the 6 day approach can be interpreted in many ways since we have no idea as to how much time is involved. We have only the belief of the writers, and they were not present at the time. So while the Bible is inspired of by God it was not written by Him. The verses you cite are useful in many ways, and 2Peter reminds us to beware of your type of teaching when it says "as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, 16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures." In the last days, we are told, there will be many of you who will teach a false form of the Gospel in an attempt to draw some from the true faith. One of the ways you try to do so is by false allegations, and by supporting the ones who will oppose the One True God of the Bible. Taking scripture out of context to support your false teaching is not proving an event happened, and you will deny such as is your habit.
Nobody mentioned popularity which only demonstrates the way in which you pervert what was said just as you do in the rest of your response. |
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Post by FEZZILLA on May 3, 2021 21:39:37 GMT
Genesis 1:1 for starters: In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. Evolution is an uncreated universe. The Bible says God created everything. Doesn't say how. Ah...it says He created. Evolution is mindless random chance. Its an uncreated process that in theory rules out the need for a creator God. You will not find any evidence in the Bible for evolution because God is not mindless and He created Adam and Eve as young adults. There were no pre-Adamites either. There was no death before Adam. |
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Post by FEZZILLA on May 3, 2021 22:05:27 GMT
Genesis 1:1 for starters: In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. Evolution is an uncreated universe. It might be necessary here to inform you that all the early church fathers very strongly opposed Darwin's theory of evolution well over 1000 years before Darwin was born. In the link below you'll see a 2nd century Christian theologian reject evolution theory. libertynewsforum.boards.net/post/61836/threadRoman's 1:18-32 and 2Peter 3:3-7 are also two passages that prophesy against evolution theory. In the Apocrypha you can read the first three chapters of Wisdom and that refutes the atheist view as well. None of the scriptures you refer to speak to the evolution theory. They speak only to the creation of the earth as a beginning, not as an end. And even the 6 day approach can be interpreted in many ways since we have no idea as to how much time is involved. We have only the belief of the writers, and they were not present at the time. So while the Bible is inspired of by God it was not written by Him. The verses you cite are useful in many ways, and 2Peter reminds us to beware of your type of teaching when it says "as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, 16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures." In the last days, we are told, there will be many of you who will teach a false form of the Gospel in an attempt to draw some from the true faith. One of the ways you try to do so is by false allegations, and by supporting the ones who will oppose the One True God of the Bible. Taking scripture out of context to support your false teaching is not proving an event happened, and you will deny such as is your habit.
Nobody mentioned popularity which only demonstrates the way in which you pervert what was said just as you do in the rest of your response. Actually the Bible speaks about the end as well. Just saying. Actually the time frame is know. If you study the right texts that give us the correct chronology like the LXX the earth is 7,000 years old. The first 3 Days of creation would have been approximately 8 to 12 hours each Day because there was no moon. At least that's the case if we go by modern calculations. On Day 4 God finished creating the universe and our solar system. It was then that we get our 24 hour day-night cycle. But prior to that there was no moon thus no lunar gravity pull on the earth to slow down its rotation. The 4th Commandment revisits creation week using the exact same word yom in the exact same context. If, say, you interpret the 6 days of creation to be a million years each then the Jews had to work 6-million years before they could take a 1-million year Sabbath rest. Some portions of the Torah like the 10 Commandments etc. were written by God Himself. As for the Prophets, they spoke from the Holy Spirit which is God speaking through the Prophet. So there is a difference between ordinary inspiration and Divine inspiration and its important not to confuse the two. Romans 1:18-32 - prophecy against evolution theory which stirs up the wrath of God www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Romans+1%3A18-32&version=MEV2Peter 3:3-7 mentions mockers who reject the Flood www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=2Peter+3%3A3-7&version=NMBWisdom chapters 1--3 (Apocrypha) -- speaks of atheism www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Wisdom+1--3&version=RSVThen we can go to the early church fathers of the first four centuries of Christianity and you'd be surprised to see how well they condemn evolution theory. Its like reading modern arguments from creationists. These ancient Christians well understood Scripture and to say the earth and all that therein is was uncreated was and still is a major heresy. The I can interpret the Bible in such a way where I can trace my interpretation back down to the early church and apostles with no gaps in the ecclesiastical lineage. |
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Post by oldtrapper on May 3, 2021 22:51:37 GMT
None of the scriptures you refer to speak to the evolution theory. They speak only to the creation of the earth as a beginning, not as an end. And even the 6 day approach can be interpreted in many ways since we have no idea as to how much time is involved. We have only the belief of the writers, and they were not present at the time. So while the Bible is inspired of by God it was not written by Him. The verses you cite are useful in many ways, and 2Peter reminds us to beware of your type of teaching when it says "as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, 16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures." In the last days, we are told, there will be many of you who will teach a false form of the Gospel in an attempt to draw some from the true faith. One of the ways you try to do so is by false allegations, and by supporting the ones who will oppose the One True God of the Bible. Taking scripture out of context to support your false teaching is not proving an event happened, and you will deny such as is your habit.
Nobody mentioned popularity which only demonstrates the way in which you pervert what was said just as you do in the rest of your response. Actually the Bible speaks about the end as well. Just saying. Actually the time frame is know. If you study the right texts that give us the correct chronology like the LXX the earth is 7,000 years old. The first 3 Days of creation would have been approximately 8 to 12 hours each Day because there was no moon. At least that's the case if we go by modern calculations. On Day 4 God finished creating the universe and our solar system. It was then that we get our 24 hour day-night cycle. But prior to that there was no moon thus no lunar gravity pull on the earth to slow down its rotation. The 4th Commandment revisits creation week using the exact same word yom in the exact same context. If, say, you interpret the 6 days of creation to be a million years each then the Jews had to work 6-million years before they could take a 1-million year Sabbath rest. Some portions of the Torah like the 10 Commandments etc. were written by God Himself. As for the Prophets, they spoke from the Holy Spirit which is God speaking through the Prophet. So there is a difference between ordinary inspiration and Divine inspiration and its important not to confuse the two. Romans 1:18-32 - prophecy against evolution theory which stirs up the wrath of God www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Romans+1%3A18-32&version=MEV2Peter 3:3-7 mentions mockers who reject the Flood www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=2Peter+3%3A3-7&version=NMBWisdom chapters 1--3 (Apocrypha) -- speaks of atheism www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Wisdom+1--3&version=RSVThen we can go to the early church fathers of the first four centuries of Christianity and you'd be surprised to see how well they condemn evolution theory. Its like reading modern arguments from creationists. These ancient Christians well understood Scripture and to say the earth and all that therein is was uncreated was and still is a major heresy. The I can interpret the Bible in such a way where I can trace my interpretation back down to the early church and apostles with no gaps in the ecclesiastical lineage. |
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Post by Running Deer on May 3, 2021 23:10:48 GMT
No one says monkeys are people, so St. Augustine is safe. |
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Post by oldtrapper on May 3, 2021 23:14:47 GMT
Once again you pervert the scripture to fit your own desires, not the desires of God, or his anointed Teachers. None of the scriptures you cite have anything to do with the creation of Man, nor is the flood referred to in 2Peter the flood of Noah. It is the "flood" referred to in Genesis 1. However, let us take a better look at your Catholicism reference since you have referred to it many times:
Wisdom 1:1-11
(note: We saw this with the followers of trump liars all, and not trusting anyone save for their gawd trump, and his minions)
(note: Well, that certainly lets trump, and his mindless followers, out)
(note: I do think he is referring to liars)
(note: Those that rely on lies, and conspiracies, should take note of this admonition.)
I could go on but an intelligent person would understand.
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Post by oldtrapper on May 3, 2021 23:26:55 GMT
The Bible says God created everything. Doesn't say how. Ah...it says He created. Evolution is mindless random chance. Its an uncreated process that in theory rules out the need for a creator God. You will not find any evidence in the Bible for evolution because God is not mindless and He created Adam and Eve as young adults. There were no pre-Adamites either. There was no death before Adam. Sounds like you are confusing natural selection with mutation, and evolution. Then too, you have no explanation for the skeletal remains prior to what we think of as Adam. |
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Post by FEZZILLA on May 4, 2021 2:08:03 GMT
No one says monkeys are people, so St. Augustine is safe. I guess I'm gonna have to start posting all the screenshots when atheists said I was an ape. Evolutionists still say we are apes. St.Augustine exposed the ape-to-man hoax before the Darwinian era. Darwin read pagan literature from the classical period which very few people had access to at the time unless they were in a major University. Evolutionists borrowed all their theory from ancient pagan philosophers but hardly anyone reads that today so people are led to think that evolution is a modern discovery. |
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Post by FEZZILLA on May 4, 2021 2:10:34 GMT
Once again you pervert the scripture to fit your own desires, not the desires of God, or his anointed Teachers. None of the scriptures you cite have anything to do with the creation of Man, nor is the flood referred to in 2Peter the flood of Noah. It is the "flood" referred to in Genesis 1. However, let us take a better look at your Catholicism reference since you have referred to it many times:
Wisdom 1:1-11
(note: We saw this with the followers of trump liars all, and not trusting anyone save for their gawd trump, and his minions) You're joking, right? You think that the left is not perverted? What do you think the LGBTQ movement is if not complete perversion. Most liberals are gay. |
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Post by oldtrapper on May 4, 2021 3:29:16 GMT
Once again you pervert the scripture to fit your own desires, not the desires of God, or his anointed Teachers. None of the scriptures you cite have anything to do with the creation of Man, nor is the flood referred to in 2Peter the flood of Noah. It is the "flood" referred to in Genesis 1. However, let us take a better look at your Catholicism reference since you have referred to it many times:
Wisdom 1:1-11
(note: We saw this with the followers of trump liars all, and not trusting anyone save for their gawd trump, and his minions) You're joking, right? You think that the left is not perverted? What do you think the LGBTQ movement is if not complete perversion. Most liberals are gay. "Most liberals are gay"? Would that include Christ since He was far from being a "conservative". As to homosexuals, Christ says nothing about them. However, He does speak to your kind being totally depraved, ad sleeping with other men. Then too, since you cannot prove anything I said to be in error you have to do the right wing thing, distract, and lie. We do not live in a theocracy, we live in a secular world. You would take the Taliban approach, and condemn all homosexuals for what you call "sin". But, since "all sins are equal in the eyes of the Lord" would not that make your lies, that of trump, or McConnell, equally egregious? And since Christ does not p=speak of homosexuals, He does speak of liars. And He says your kind will not inherit the Kingdom of God. And for you to think that only the left is filled with homosexuals only shows your own self deception. |
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Post by FEZZILLA on May 4, 2021 6:42:07 GMT
You're joking, right? You think that the left is not perverted? What do you think the LGBTQ movement is if not complete perversion. Most liberals are gay. "Most liberals are gay"? Would that include Christ since He was far from being a "conservative". As to homosexuals, Christ says nothing about them. However, He does speak to your kind being totally depraved, ad sleeping with other men. Then too, since you cannot prove anything I said to be in error you have to do the right wing thing, distract, and lie. We do not live in a theocracy, we live in a secular world. You would take the Taliban approach, and condemn all homosexuals for what you call "sin". But, since "all sins are equal in the eyes of the Lord" would not that make your lies, that of trump, or McConnell, equally egregious? And since Christ does not p=speak of homosexuals, He does speak of liars. And He says your kind will not inherit the Kingdom of God. And for you to think that only the left is filled with homosexuals only shows your own self deception. Jesus was no liberal! He fulfilled prophecy which was conservative to the Scriptures. Jesus did not change the law or the Prophets. His life and works were consistent with all the numerous prophecies concerning Him. Jesus was not gay nor did He contradict the law about homosexuality. The Apostles spoke the word of Jesus and you'll find a few passages where Jesus speaks through the Apostles condemning homosexuality. We conservatives by and large oppose homosexuality. Its you liberals who are into LGBTQ perversion. You actually empower the Taliban by your embrace for that Satanic cult of Islam. Yeah, in that death cult gays are killed. Homosexuals must repent from their sin and turn away from their sin if they want to be saved. There will be no unrepentant homosexuals in heaven. Scripture is very clear about this and if you don't know this then you never read the Bible. You are in complete denial over everything. You act just like a drug addict. |
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Post by oldtrapper on May 4, 2021 20:14:11 GMT
"Most liberals are gay"? Would that include Christ since He was far from being a "conservative". As to homosexuals, Christ says nothing about them. However, He does speak to your kind being totally depraved, ad sleeping with other men. Then too, since you cannot prove anything I said to be in error you have to do the right wing thing, distract, and lie. We do not live in a theocracy, we live in a secular world. You would take the Taliban approach, and condemn all homosexuals for what you call "sin". But, since "all sins are equal in the eyes of the Lord" would not that make your lies, that of trump, or McConnell, equally egregious? And since Christ does not p=speak of homosexuals, He does speak of liars. And He says your kind will not inherit the Kingdom of God. And for you to think that only the left is filled with homosexuals only shows your own self deception. Jesus was no liberal! He fulfilled prophecy which was conservative to the Scriptures. Jesus did not change the law or the Prophets. His life and works were consistent with all the numerous prophecies concerning Him. Jesus was not gay nor did He contradict the law about homosexuality. The Apostles spoke the word of Jesus and you'll find a few passages where Jesus speaks through the Apostles condemning homosexuality. We conservatives by and large oppose homosexuality. Its you liberals who are into LGBTQ perversion. You actually empower the Taliban by your embrace for that Satanic cult of Islam. Yeah, in that death cult gays are killed. Homosexuals must repent from their sin and turn away from their sin if they want to be saved. There will be no unrepentant homosexuals in heaven. Scripture is very clear about this and if you don't know this then you never read the Bible. You are in complete denial over everything. You act just like a drug addict. You are so lost I do not know if you can ever find your way back. Obviously you do not understand, or know, scripture as well as I do, and you certainly have not the balls to try and teach your line of crap on a theology forum. Like in other topics you try to form a stance on, in this one you again show just how ignorant you are. Here is a good description of your gawds, and what you support:
1Corinthians 6:7-10
"Now therefore, it is already an utter failure for you that you go to law against one another. Why do you not rather accept wrong? Why do you not rather let yourselves be cheated? No, you yourselves do wrong and cheat, and you do these things to your brethren! Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites, nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God." |
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Post by FEZZILLA on May 5, 2021 2:46:41 GMT
Jesus was no liberal! He fulfilled prophecy which was conservative to the Scriptures. Jesus did not change the law or the Prophets. His life and works were consistent with all the numerous prophecies concerning Him. Jesus was not gay nor did He contradict the law about homosexuality. The Apostles spoke the word of Jesus and you'll find a few passages where Jesus speaks through the Apostles condemning homosexuality. We conservatives by and large oppose homosexuality. Its you liberals who are into LGBTQ perversion. You actually empower the Taliban by your embrace for that Satanic cult of Islam. Yeah, in that death cult gays are killed. Homosexuals must repent from their sin and turn away from their sin if they want to be saved. There will be no unrepentant homosexuals in heaven. Scripture is very clear about this and if you don't know this then you never read the Bible. You are in complete denial over everything. You act just like a drug addict. You are so lost I do not know if you can ever find your way back. Obviously you do not understand, or know, scripture as well as I do, and you certainly have not the balls to try and teach your line of crap on a theology forum. Like in other topics you try to form a stance on, in this one you again show just how ignorant you are. Here is a good description of your gawds, and what you support:
1Corinthians 6:7-10
"Now therefore, it is already an utter failure for you that you go to law against one another. Why do you not rather accept wrong? Why do you not rather let yourselves be cheated? No, you yourselves do wrong and cheat, and you do these things to your brethren! Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites, nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God." Hey Mr.Twisted, We Christians don't approve of those things and we know the passage very well. I think you do not even know your own party's stance on things like homosexuality etc. Either that, or you are just trying your hardest to twist as much as you can in hopes that will get you somewhere. But it won't. The human mind isn't as dumb as you think it is. |
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Post by Mercy for All on May 8, 2021 22:41:25 GMT
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Post by FEZZILLA on May 11, 2021 5:20:07 GMT
The author of that article believes the account was merely borrowed from Babylonian accounts--which also say the Flood was global. But it was God there on Mt.Sinai with Moses. It was God Who approved the Torah. So regardless of whether the Flood is the oldest account or not is unimportant, because it was God Who approved Genesis as the true account. Modern science agrees with the Genesis account. The Babylonian account was a retelling and you can see that in the scientific errors in the account. For example, the Babylonian ark was a giant cube, 120x120x120 cubits. This means that about half of its mass, roughly 60 cubits, was under water. Water pressure down that deep with the ship building skills of the day would rip he seams open and the ark would sink. But the Biblical dimensions of the ark were so advanced for the time that it passes the modern science test today. And yes, we can scientifically investigate these matters and when we do we confirm these accounts to be true. |
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Post by FEZZILLA on May 11, 2021 6:18:04 GMT
Anyway, I think I'm done with this forum. It takes far too long to get replies here and nobody here is intellectually honest to begin with. I simply have better things to do with my time other than to throw it away like this.
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Post by Mercy for All on May 11, 2021 14:16:49 GMT
The author of that article believes the account was merely borrowed from Babylonian accounts--which also say the Flood was global. But it was God there on Mt.Sinai with Moses. It was God Who approved the Torah. That's an interesting take. By "Torah" you mean the first five books of the Bible? God "approved that" on Sinai? Including the parts that had yet to be written? |
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Post by Mercy for All on May 11, 2021 14:18:37 GMT
Anyway, I think I'm done with this forum. It takes far too long to get replies here and nobody here is intellectually honest to begin with. I simply have better things to do with my time other than to throw it away like this. Too bad. Weird, though, that you post a lot at a time, then leave for a while. Well, that's not weird—I tend to do the same thing. What's weird is that you claim "it takes far too long to get replies" when you take a long time to reply as well. Don't you think? I think it's also weird to presume that disagreement with you indicates intellectual dishonesty. Seems somewhat narcissistic, no? |
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