demos
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Post by demos on Apr 30, 2024 0:17:44 GMT
Muslims & Evangelicals both readily forgive deceit if it suits their agenda. That was my main point. There are probably more religions that could be included; but this started from reading about taqiyya. Neither of your examples - lying to save the life of oneself or others - really support this point (unless your argument is that saving lives in some nefarious agenda). I think you're also ignoring a whole lot of Christian and Muslim commentary on the ethics and morality of lying, i.e., when it may be appropriate and when it is not.
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demos
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Post by demos on Apr 30, 2024 0:21:21 GMT
Enough of it went along with it to make the pope the most powerful despote in history.
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sokpupet
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Go Dark Brandon!
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Post by sokpupet on Apr 30, 2024 0:49:43 GMT
Muslims & Evangelicals both readily forgive deceit if it suits their agenda. That was my main point. There are probably more religions that could be included; but this started from reading about taqiyya. Neither of your examples - lying to save the life of oneself or others - really support this point (unless your argument is that saving lives in some nefarious agenda). I think you're also ignoring a whole lot of Christian and Muslim commentary on the ethics and morality of lying, i.e., when it may be appropriate and when it is not. Let me be clear; I know there are good guys in both religions.
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Post by DaveJavu on Apr 30, 2024 1:11:35 GMT
Enough of it went along with it to make the pope the most powerful despote in history. Nice rebuttal.
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demos
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Post by demos on Apr 30, 2024 1:31:06 GMT
When you write something that hysterical, that's the appropriate response. (Especially since I know you can't actually back that up on any historical basis).
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demos
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Post by demos on Apr 30, 2024 1:32:41 GMT
Let me be clear; I know there are good guys in both religions. And this doesn't address the point. Both have teachings on the ethics and morality of lying which belie the argument you're trying to make based on religious beliefs.
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Post by HolyMoly on Apr 30, 2024 3:12:42 GMT
If the primary case against the Exodus is the number of people, then it’s not a strong argument. Numbers in ancient Hebrew texts are strong on symbolism, with what we read as the “thousands” number actually signifying numbers of leaders. The large number of exodusees is one factor. Another is the doubt that people left all at the same time and from the same place and that it was a one time thing. And then there is the larger question of authorship and times of composition and the historicity of Moses. It works better as a religious document than an historical one.
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Post by slefty on Apr 30, 2024 4:40:41 GMT
Brain washing is what I'm really referring to. Religion is a tool to do so. Correct, perhaps not all religions, but religions with supernatural components or things that require belief without evidence.
Brainwashing is done through repetition, nutrition deprivation, loud music, sleep deprivation, and emotional manipulation. Are you sure that's what all religions are "about"? Here's the thing Freon talks about, YOUR definition seems to say you need all those things to be brainwashing. Brainwashing can be as simple to tell a child all the time there is a father in the sky and a Santa Claus and an Easter bunny and Jesus is with you all the time. Then when they get older you say hey we were just kidding about Santa and the Easter bunny but there really is a sky father who knows everything about you and Jesus will always be with you though you can talk to him but he wont talk back. He will protect you well except at times he wont. You will then work your hands to the bones and ruin your body and mental health making you work harder and harder with less food.Then good news you will leave sick life style and when you finally die from some wasting disease you will die gladly and join Jesus and the sky father in heaven when you eat wonderfull tasty food and beds are soft and body stink will be eradicated tooth decay gone all your all the aches and injuries will by better God And when you do die its bliss do any thing you want, if you like the taste of come welcome plenty supplies available you want to fuck Nicole Kidman help yourself this is heaven, have fun but stay away from the corner people will convert you to a different kind of god and you will catch fire. Voted heavens worse painful place to die. And some of these related religious plan on cutting the tip off you dick. What's a little pain for god. Peeing blood is sacred. A mile down the road the women can get circumcised for free..
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Post by DaveJavu on Apr 30, 2024 9:00:57 GMT
Brainwashing is done through repetition, nutrition deprivation, loud music, sleep deprivation, and emotional manipulation. Are you sure that's what all religions are "about"? Here's the thing Freon talks about, YOUR definition seems to say you need all those things to be brainwashing. Brainwashing can be as simple to tell a child all the time there is a father in the sky and a Santa Claus and an Easter bunny and Jesus is with you all the time. Then when they get older you say hey we were just kidding about Santa and the Easter bunny but there really is a sky father who knows everything about you and Jesus will always be with you though you can talk to him but he wont talk back. He will protect you well except at times he wont. You will then work your hands to the bones and ruin your body and mental health making you work harder and harder with less food.Then good news you will leave sick life style and when you finally die from some wasting disease you will die gladly and join Jesus and the sky father in heaven when you eat wonderfull tasty food and beds are soft and body stink will be eradicated tooth decay gone all your all the aches and injuries will by better God And when you do die its bliss do any thing you want, if you like the taste of come welcome plenty supplies available you want to fuck Nicole Kidman help yourself this is heaven, have fun but stay away from the corner people will convert you to a different kind of god and you will catch fire. Voted heavens worse painful place to die. And some of these related religious plan on cutting the tip off you dick. What's a little pain for god. Peeing blood is sacred. A mile down the road the women can get circumcised for free.. It's always a rigmarole with these guys, isn't it?
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Post by Mercy for All on Apr 30, 2024 13:36:37 GMT
If the primary case against the Exodus is the number of people, then it’s not a strong argument. Numbers in ancient Hebrew texts are strong on symbolism, with what we read as the “thousands” number actually signifying numbers of leaders. The large number of exodusees is one factor. Another is the doubt that people left all at the same time and from the same place and that it was a one time thing. And then there is the larger question of authorship and times of composition and the historicity of Moses. It works better as a religious document than an historical one. It definitely works better as a religious document than a historical one. Claims to a "Moses authorship" are based on extra-biblical tradition; the text does not even claim that Moses wrote it. Most scholarship today would see a collection of ancient texts (written and verbal) assembled and edited together sometime during the Babylonian Exile (and there's a lot to be said for that perspective).
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Post by Mercy for All on Apr 30, 2024 13:38:39 GMT
Brainwashing is done through repetition, nutrition deprivation, loud music, sleep deprivation, and emotional manipulation. Are you sure that's what all religions are "about"? Here's the thing Freon talks about, YOUR definition seems to say you need all those things to be brainwashing. Brainwashing can be as simple to tell a child all the time there is a father in the sky and a Santa Claus and an Easter bunny and Jesus is with you all the time. Then when they get older you say hey we were just kidding about Santa and the Easter bunny but there really is a sky father who knows everything about you and Jesus will always be with you though you can talk to him but he wont talk back. He will protect you well except at times he wont. You will then work your hands to the bones and ruin your body and mental health making you work harder and harder with less food.Then good news you will leave sick life style and when you finally die from some wasting disease you will die gladly and join Jesus and the sky father in heaven when you eat wonderfull tasty food and beds are soft and body stink will be eradicated tooth decay gone all your all the aches and injuries will by better God And when you do die its bliss do any thing you want, if you like the taste of come welcome plenty supplies available you want to fuck Nicole Kidman help yourself this is heaven, have fun but stay away from the corner people will convert you to a different kind of god and you will catch fire. Voted heavens worse painful place to die. And some of these related religious plan on cutting the tip off you dick. What's a little pain for god. Peeing blood is sacred. A mile down the road the women can get circumcised for free.. It's interesting how few skeptics can have a religious conversation in good faith without distortion, misrepresentation, and straight up mockery, as if the conversation must be had at the lowest level of intellect with no attempt to understand anything at all—like they wouldn't do at all in any other field whatsoever.
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Post by rabbitreborn on Apr 30, 2024 13:40:30 GMT
Brainwashing is done through repetition, nutrition deprivation, loud music, sleep deprivation, and emotional manipulation. Are you sure that's what all religions are "about"? Here's the thing Freon talks about, YOUR definition seems to say you need all those things to be brainwashing. Brainwashing can be as simple to tell a child all the time there is a father in the sky and a Santa Claus and an Easter bunny and Jesus is with you all the time. Then when they get older you say hey we were just kidding about Santa and the Easter bunny but there really is a sky father who knows everything about you and Jesus will always be with you though you can talk to him but he wont talk back. He will protect you well except at times he wont. You will then work your hands to the bones and ruin your body and mental health making you work harder and harder with less food.Then good news you will leave sick life style and when you finally die from some wasting disease you will die gladly and join Jesus and the sky father in heaven when you eat wonderfull tasty food and beds are soft and body stink will be eradicated tooth decay gone all your all the aches and injuries will by better God And when you do die its bliss do any thing you want, if you like the taste of come welcome plenty supplies available you want to fuck Nicole Kidman help yourself this is heaven, have fun but stay away from the corner people will convert you to a different kind of god and you will catch fire. Voted heavens worse painful place to die. And some of these related religious plan on cutting the tip off you dick. What's a little pain for god. Peeing blood is sacred. A mile down the road the women can get circumcised for free.. I'm impressed by your proper understanding of scripture. Very impressive. Let me guess, you've read the Bible cover-to-cover multiple times. Am I right?
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Paleocon
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We spent 50 Years fighting the USSR just to become a gay, retarded version of It.
Posts: 6,286
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Post by Paleocon on Apr 30, 2024 14:22:47 GMT
Here's the thing Freon talks about, YOUR definition seems to say you need all those things to be brainwashing. Brainwashing can be as simple to tell a child all the time there is a father in the sky and a Santa Claus and an Easter bunny and Jesus is with you all the time. Then when they get older you say hey we were just kidding about Santa and the Easter bunny but there really is a sky father who knows everything about you and Jesus will always be with you though you can talk to him but he wont talk back. He will protect you well except at times he wont. You will then work your hands to the bones and ruin your body and mental health making you work harder and harder with less food.Then good news you will leave sick life style and when you finally die from some wasting disease you will die gladly and join Jesus and the sky father in heaven when you eat wonderfull tasty food and beds are soft and body stink will be eradicated tooth decay gone all your all the aches and injuries will by better God And when you do die its bliss do any thing you want, if you like the taste of come welcome plenty supplies available you want to fuck Nicole Kidman help yourself this is heaven, have fun but stay away from the corner people will convert you to a different kind of god and you will catch fire. Voted heavens worse painful place to die. And some of these related religious plan on cutting the tip off you dick. What's a little pain for god. Peeing blood is sacred. A mile down the road the women can get circumcised for free.. It's interesting how few skeptics can have a religious conversation in good faith without distortion, misrepresentation, and straight up mockery, as if the conversation must be had at the lowest level of intellect with no attempt to understand anything at all—like they wouldn't do at all in any other field whatsoever. Mercy, you're expecting morality and manners from people that hate us because we are Christians. And, make no mistake, it IS hatred that drives them to hyperbolic heights like this. Sadly, their lives are wasted and shallow because they reject any belief beyond their limited senses. Insanely jealous of the spiritual peace that Christians do have, they want us all to dumb down to their "lowest level of intellect" and join them in their morally relativistic world view.
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petep
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Post by petep on Apr 30, 2024 14:28:59 GMT
Here's the thing Freon talks about, YOUR definition seems to say you need all those things to be brainwashing. Brainwashing can be as simple to tell a child all the time there is a father in the sky and a Santa Claus and an Easter bunny and Jesus is with you all the time. Then when they get older you say hey we were just kidding about Santa and the Easter bunny but there really is a sky father who knows everything about you and Jesus will always be with you though you can talk to him but he wont talk back. He will protect you well except at times he wont. You will then work your hands to the bones and ruin your body and mental health making you work harder and harder with less food.Then good news you will leave sick life style and when you finally die from some wasting disease you will die gladly and join Jesus and the sky father in heaven when you eat wonderfull tasty food and beds are soft and body stink will be eradicated tooth decay gone all your all the aches and injuries will by better God And when you do die its bliss do any thing you want, if you like the taste of come welcome plenty supplies available you want to fuck Nicole Kidman help yourself this is heaven, have fun but stay away from the corner people will convert you to a different kind of god and you will catch fire. Voted heavens worse painful place to die. And some of these related religious plan on cutting the tip off you dick. What's a little pain for god. Peeing blood is sacred. A mile down the road the women can get circumcised for free.. It's interesting how few skeptics can have a religious conversation in good faith without distortion, misrepresentation, and straight up mockery, as if the conversation must be had at the lowest level of intellect with no attempt to understand anything at all—like they wouldn't do at all in any other field whatsoever. You’d think even the most left would believe in some spirituality that you are born with inate rights. What’s the alternative. Your rights come from another man. Simply, the user had state sponsored atheism. So rights came from govt leaders. Who wants that. If nothing else pretend you believe in some higher power than man just to avoid being a slave to another man. Usually under a communist regime it’s these leftist protesters and radicals and artists and former free thinkers who are the first to be jailed. It todays leftists are not the 60’e hippies they are the brown shirts in lock step with authoritarians.
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Post by atreyu on Apr 30, 2024 16:41:00 GMT
It's interesting how few skeptics can have a religious conversation in good faith without distortion, misrepresentation, and straight up mockery, as if the conversation must be had at the lowest level of intellect with no attempt to understand anything at all—like they wouldn't do at all in any other field whatsoever. You’d think even the most left would believe in some spirituality that you are born with inate rights. What’s the alternative. Your rights come from another man. Simply, the user had state sponsored atheism. So rights came from govt leaders. Who wants that. If nothing else pretend you believe in some higher power than man just to avoid being a slave to another man. Usually under a communist regime it’s these leftist protesters and radicals and artists and former free thinkers who are the first to be jailed. It todays leftists are not the 60’e hippies they are the brown shirts in lock step with authoritarians.
You're rights do come from what we all agree on dummy. So sure, your rights all come from another man that's why different places have different rights, rules, and regulations.
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Post by Mercy for All on Apr 30, 2024 17:06:38 GMT
You’d think even the most left would believe in some spirituality that you are born with inate rights. What’s the alternative. Your rights come from another man. Simply, the user had state sponsored atheism. So rights came from govt leaders. Who wants that. If nothing else pretend you believe in some higher power than man just to avoid being a slave to another man. Usually under a communist regime it’s these leftist protesters and radicals and artists and former free thinkers who are the first to be jailed. It todays leftists are not the 60’e hippies they are the brown shirts in lock step with authoritarians.
You're rights do come from what we all agree on dummy. So sure, your rights all come from another man that's why different places have different rights, rules, and regulations.
So it's okay for "people to agree differently"? Like...was Kristallnacht "okay" because the majority agreed that it was?
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petep
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Post by petep on Apr 30, 2024 17:35:36 GMT
You're rights do come from what we all agree on dummy. So sure, your rights all come from another man that's why different places have different rights, rules, and regulations.
So it's okay for "people to agree differently"? Like...was Kristallnacht "okay" because the majority agreed that it was? I read his response and I can’t believe there are people alive today who actually believe this way Heck most picked the party who choose Hitler. Oh well. Those exterminated had no rights
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Post by Mercy for All on Apr 30, 2024 17:54:31 GMT
So it's okay for "people to agree differently"? Like...was Kristallnacht "okay" because the majority agreed that it was? I read his response and I can’t believe there are people alive today who actually believe this way Heck most picked the party who choose Hitler. Oh well. Those exterminated had no rights Well, yeah, they were dehumanized. Dehumanizing people gives the opportunity to scapegoat them and eliminate them. We always run the risk of dehumanizing those we perceive as threat, or worst, objects of contempt. The concept of the innate value of every human being (from "image of God") counters the dehumanizing of perceived threats, whether they be religious or irreligious, conservative or liberal, LGBTQ+ or "cisgender," culturally dominant or immigrant, etc.
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petep
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Post by petep on Apr 30, 2024 18:10:32 GMT
I read his response and I can’t believe there are people alive today who actually believe this way Heck most picked the party who choose Hitler. Oh well. Those exterminated had no rights Well, yeah, they were dehumanized. Dehumanizing people gives the opportunity to scapegoat them and eliminate them. We always run the risk of dehumanizing those we perceive as threat, or worst, objects of contempt. The concept of the innate value of every human being (from "image of God") counters the dehumanizing of perceived threats, whether they be religious or irreligious, conservative or liberal, LGBTQ+ or "cisgender," culturally dominant or immigrant, etc. I wonder who gives an atheist inate rights. I believe all have them. I’m just curious when the king or authoritarian socialist state says your rights come from govt.
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Fiddler
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Wasted again ..
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Post by Fiddler on Apr 30, 2024 18:25:23 GMT
Yeah .. That's it ..
Best archeological evidence says that they weren't in Egypt.. Israelites had a Canaanite origin.. Then what good is Faith if you demand evidence.. Right?
The well-known Merneptah Stele (c. 1219 B.C.E.) refers to “Israel” along with three towns—Ashkelon, Gezer and Yeno’am. The Egyptian classifier for “town” is attached to each of these three. The classifier attached to “Israel,” however, is for “people.” Israel had therefore not yet created settlements in what was to become the land of Israel.
Thus we have evidence of population groups in Egypt and elsewhere in the late Ramesside period (late 13th–12th century B.C.E.) who were culturally and ethnically close to what we know as Israel in the Iron Age (c. 1200–586 B.C.E.).
The Egyptians were notorious about erasing previous history to suit the current rulers. It would certainly be in their nature to try to hide the kind of humiliating losses that they suffered during the Exodus.
Good info.. Thanks.. I'll use that the next time I need to show that there is no evidence for Israelites being in 15 century BC Egypt..
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