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Post by Deleted on Oct 20, 2022 16:01:43 GMT
Yeah. War and defense spending are always going to come first. There's always money in the banana stand! 
Beautiful lol
I've been saying that in PMs and emails for months now and I'm never sure anyone gets the reference.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 20, 2022 16:03:42 GMT
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demos
Legend
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Post by demos on Oct 20, 2022 16:06:15 GMT
I may have committed some... light treason.
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Post by limey² on Oct 20, 2022 16:52:49 GMT
The nature of EU supply chains and crossborder contracting means basically the economic elites won't be permitting any nonsense about military conflict between EU nations. That was the entire point of the original ECSC. Yes, and the more international governing institutions you have like this (EU parliament, etc.), the more mechanisms for nonviolent dispute resolution, etc., the less reliance on war to achieve ends. IMO.
You need strong institutions, buy in, and someone/thing who can enforce a general peace (NATO and the US, e.g.).
If these didn't exist (like they didn't through much of history and even in much of the world today), I think you'd have a very different situation wherein even European democracies would possibly go to war with one another.
It's an interesting question to consider, and there's been a lot of discussion and debate about democratic peace theory over the years.
All of which supports the idea that assisting Ukraine against Russia is, long term, in the self interest of those nations seeking peace and prosperity. Ukraine joining the EU would be an unequivocally good thing. Actually, Russia joining the EU would be an unequivocally good thing. |
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Post by Lomelis on Oct 21, 2022 7:03:25 GMT
Is Britain the only country that is completely dependent on the US for defense? Are we? Gosh. That must be quite the enjoyable fantasy for Americans ignorant of anything to do with matters military. I was just messing with you. Britain isn't the only defenseless country we protect. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 21, 2022 7:19:27 GMT
It's funny how you keep lying about having been Rick's friend. The two of you couldn't be more different. While Rick has been banned 150 times (by his own estimate) for getting into fights with various assholes like you, you never stopped sucking admin's dick long enough to say something that would have displeased him. |
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Odysseus
Legend
Trump = Disaster
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Post by Odysseus on Oct 21, 2022 7:27:05 GMT
It's funny how you keep lying about having been Rick's friend. The two of you couldn't be more different. While Rick has been banned 150 times (by his own estimate) for getting into fights with various assholes like you, you never stopped sucking admin's dick long enough to say something that would have displeased him.
Kinky!
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Post by limey² on Oct 21, 2022 11:07:03 GMT
Are we? Gosh. That must be quite the enjoyable fantasy for Americans ignorant of anything to do with matters military. I was just messing with you. Britain isn't the only defenseless country we protect. Ah, your fantasy landscape is rich and textured. I see. Actually on second thoughts quite a few European nations have effectively disarmed themselves lately.... and if the Conservatives stay in power here we'll be in the same position. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 21, 2022 11:22:16 GMT
I was just messing with you. Britain isn't the only defenseless country we protect. Ah, your fantasy landscape is rich and textured. I see. Actually on second thoughts quite a few European nations have effectively disarmed themselves lately.... and if the Conservatives stay in power here we'll be in the same position. Do you think viagra would help? |
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Post by limey² on Oct 21, 2022 13:12:29 GMT
Ah, your fantasy landscape is rich and textured. I see. Actually on second thoughts quite a few European nations have effectively disarmed themselves lately.... and if the Conservatives stay in power here we'll be in the same position. Do you think viagra would help? Me or Lomelis? |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 21, 2022 15:49:06 GMT
Do you think viagra would help? Me or Lomelis? The conservatives for their "staying power".  |
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demos
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Post by demos on Oct 21, 2022 15:55:01 GMT
All of which supports the idea that assisting Ukraine against Russia is, long term, in the self interest of those nations seeking peace and prosperity. Ukraine joining the EU would be an unequivocally good thing. Actually, Russia joining the EU would be an unequivocally good thing.There was a very brief moment in time when Russia as a member of NATO was considered a possibility, but that faded fast. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 21, 2022 23:43:23 GMT
Weird. Who could have seen this coming six years to the day??? Doesn't Russia know what's good for it? Doesn't Russia know ALL OF TWITTER STANDS AGAINST THEM???
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Post by Lomelis on Oct 22, 2022 5:38:25 GMT
I was just messing with you. Britain isn't the only defenseless country we protect. Ah, your fantasy landscape is rich and textured. I see. Actually on second thoughts quite a few European nations have effectively disarmed themselves lately.... and if the Conservatives stay in power here we'll be in the same position. It's going to really suck for you guys when we cut off the money and weapons tit. Or maybe not...right? |
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Post by limey² on Oct 22, 2022 11:47:48 GMT
Ah, your fantasy landscape is rich and textured. I see. Actually on second thoughts quite a few European nations have effectively disarmed themselves lately.... and if the Conservatives stay in power here we'll be in the same position. It's going to really suck for you guys when we cut off the money and weapons tit. Or maybe not...right? Money? Lol. If you can point at "the money tit" specifically relevant to the UK that'll be great. Weapons? We're buying F35 at commercial rates, having been a technology partner in its development. Rivet Joint and some other systems too.... can't think of any US systems in UK use that have been in any way freebies. Ever. |
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Post by Lomelis on Oct 23, 2022 16:31:05 GMT
It's going to really suck for you guys when we cut off the money and weapons tit. Or maybe not...right? Money? Lol. If you can point at "the money tit" specifically relevant to the UK that'll be great. Weapons? We're buying F35 at commercial rates, having been a technology partner in its development. Rivet Joint and some other systems too.... can't think of any US systems in UK use that have been in any way freebies. Ever. Oh, I wasn't referring to direct aid to the UK. What happens when we cut off the tit to Ukraine, maybe even NATO? Are you guys going to step up? |
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Odysseus
Legend
Trump = Disaster
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Post by Odysseus on Oct 23, 2022 16:49:36 GMT
It's going to really suck for you guys when we cut off the money and weapons tit. Or maybe not...right? Money? Lol. If you can point at "the money tit" specifically relevant to the UK that'll be great. Weapons? We're buying F35 at commercial rates, having been a technology partner in its development. Rivet Joint and some other systems too.... can't think of any US systems in UK use that have been in any way freebies. Ever.
"Rivet Joint"? Nightclub for GI's in SoHo?
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Post by limey² on Oct 23, 2022 18:03:27 GMT
Money? Lol. If you can point at "the money tit" specifically relevant to the UK that'll be great. Weapons? We're buying F35 at commercial rates, having been a technology partner in its development. Rivet Joint and some other systems too.... can't think of any US systems in UK use that have been in any way freebies. Ever. Oh, I wasn't referring to direct aid to the UK. What happens when we cut off the tit to Ukraine, maybe even NATO? Are you guys going to step up? I think UK, German and French and Polish contributions to Ukraine are comparable (in %of GDP terms) to US ones; not identical, but ball park. Could br wrong. I know there are firm plans for significantly more hardware/int/training support already. What will trigger that, I don't know. Again, though, US and wider Western support for Ukraine is primarily motivated by cold self interest. It simply isn't a long term benefit to Western nations to let Ukraine fall under the Kremlin's control. A lesson from history about appeasement looks to have been learned. |
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Post by limey² on Oct 23, 2022 18:04:14 GMT
Money? Lol. If you can point at "the money tit" specifically relevant to the UK that'll be great. Weapons? We're buying F35 at commercial rates, having been a technology partner in its development. Rivet Joint and some other systems too.... can't think of any US systems in UK use that have been in any way freebies. Ever.
"Rivet Joint"? Nightclub for GI's in SoHo?
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Post by Lomelis on Oct 23, 2022 18:34:42 GMT
Oh, I wasn't referring to direct aid to the UK. What happens when we cut off the tit to Ukraine, maybe even NATO? Are you guys going to step up? I think UK, German and French and Polish contributions to Ukraine are comparable (in %of GDP terms) to US ones; not identical, but ball park. Could br wrong. I know there are firm plans for significantly more hardware/int/training support already. What will trigger that, I don't know. Again, though, US and wider Western support for Ukraine is primarily motivated by cold self interest. It simply isn't a long term benefit to Western nations to let Ukraine fall under the Kremlin's control. A lesson from history about appeasement looks to have been learned. I'm not sure %GDP contributions would be as important as the actual amount of aid. I think the US has pledged about $50-60 billion in aid so far? Latvia has contributed significantly more as a percentage of GDP but that absolute dollar amount is a drop in the bucket compared to $50 something billion. Of course this is motivated by cold self interest, but it isn't the interest of the regular population. It's in the interests of those who profit off never ending war. It means absolutely nothing to us (the regular people in the US) if Russia takes a piece of Ukraine. It absolutely means something to us when we are funding never ending war and potentially risking nuclear conflict. |
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