petep
Legend
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Post by petep on Aug 11, 2020 20:04:08 GMT
freon does not understand a very simple concept...no words cant hurt you...you are 100% responsible for how you react to words...if you are so weak and pathetic a person, that some word like he references sends you into a tailspin, you have much larger psychological problems...
freon, I highly recommend a book - crucial conversations -
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Post by freonbale on Aug 11, 2020 20:34:12 GMT
freon does not understand a very simple concept...no words cant hurt you...you are 100% responsible for how you react to words...if you are so weak and pathetic a person, that some word like he references sends you into a tailspin, you have much larger psychological problems... freon, I highly recommend a book - crucial conversations - Ok, thanks for the tip.
I've got one for you. The Bible.
Freon
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Post by freonbale on Aug 11, 2020 20:36:02 GMT
Leftists: You can't say this, this, this, this, this, or this. Also leftists: We're going to stand in front of your car so you can't go where you want. Yeah, this is all about power and control. It's harassment, and it's abuse. It's about decency, nothing more.
Do you even have values?
Freon
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Post by freonbale on Aug 11, 2020 20:39:06 GMT
One of the big problems with this idea is that the category of things that are "offensive" has a tendency to expand. Once we go along with one list of offensive words or ideas, then the next one is trotted out, and then the next and the next. Each time sets precedent for the next one. Maybe at first we could be excused for going along with this because we were trying to be nice, but now that we see that this is an interminable process and it is being abused, we should put a stop to going along with it. And I don't at all buy the claim that this is about being offended. I think it's about control. Some people like to control others. They like to draw imaginary lines that no one can step over. It's a personality type. It's a game they like to play. And once these people find out they can control others by making claims about internal states (i.e., being offended) that no one has access to but them and so no one can prove they aren't really offended, they will abuse this tactic and start using it all the time, for no other reason than arbitrary control. Giving in to this personality type and its abuse may take the pressure off in the short run, but in the long run it just makes it worse and the demands greater and greater. This is exactly what we are seeing. And what's really ironic about all this is that the same people who are making these nitpicky demands about what words we use are breaking the law in obscene ways, or they are supporting others who do. You have to imagine, the people who are rioting, looting, destroying property, hurting others, and tearing apart the foundations of civilization, and the people who are cheering them on, are not following the basic fundamental rules of our society. But they've decided they are offended by some words people say, and these rules people must follow. The personality type we are talking about here is that of the psychopath. You realize that using a 'slippery slope' argument is considered a logical fallacy.
It's called that because you cannot predict the future. Just because you do one thing, does not mean the same thing, at a greater scale, is going to occur.
You are confusing logic with fear. You FEAR that if you do one thing, you will open the floodgates to something more.
I don't live in fear, so it's hard to empathize. And so little effort is needed to be kind to your neighbors, it's really hard to understand your fuss.
Freon
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Post by freonbale on Aug 11, 2020 21:14:31 GMT
It's about decency, nothing more.
Do you even have values?
Freon
Where's the indecency? In offending people? What proof do we have that anyone has been offended? What is offensive, though, or I will say undeserving of respect, is manipulativeness, as well as chastizing others for not following silly little rules that mean nothing, while at the same time breaking every rule in the book for which there are good reasons. DO you have values?
Are you guided by a code, or do you just make it up as you go?
I have values. I try hard to adhere to them. I am happy because I know I am trying to follow them.
You sound angry. In fact, all you Trumpers sound angry all the time. That cannot be good for you, and I find it hard to believe you make rational decisions when in that state. Angry people with guns. There's a good combination.
Freon
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Post by Mercy for All on Aug 11, 2020 21:39:28 GMT
freon, I highly recommend a book - crucial conversations - Great book. I found it so challenging, I couldn't finish it. I put it down temporarily intending to finish later, then lent to someone and never got it back...I don't remember to whom I lent it. |
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Post by Mercy for All on Aug 11, 2020 21:54:30 GMT
It's about decency, nothing more.
Do you even have values?
Freon
Decency, respect for others, yes. But striving to avoid all offence is impossible. The opportunity for offence is infinite. |
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Post by Mercy for All on Aug 11, 2020 21:55:46 GMT
I don't live in fear, so it's hard to empathize. And so little effort is needed to be kind to your neighbors, it's really hard to understand your fuss.
Freon
This is true. Well, it's true insofar as we deal with individuals. It's the group identification and group offence that really complicates things. |
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Post by Mercy for All on Aug 11, 2020 21:56:21 GMT
Where's the indecency? In offending people? What proof do we have that anyone has been offended? When they say so... |
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Post by freonbale on Aug 11, 2020 22:27:31 GMT
DO you have values?
Are you guided by a code, or do you just make it up as you go?
I have values. I try hard to adhere to them. I am happy because I know I am trying to follow them.
You sound angry. In fact, all you Trumpers sound angry all the time. That cannot be good for you, and I find it hard to believe you make rational decisions when in that state. Angry people with guns. There's a good combination.
Freon
>You're angry if you don't obey me. There's that manipulativeness again. And let's see, what else? >You're scared if you don't obey me. >You're not decent if you don't obey me. >You make me feel unsafe if you don't obey me. >You're victimizing me if you don't obey me. Etc. The thing about magic tricks and other scams is that you're not supposed to do them more than once in front of the same audience, or they'll figure out what you're doing. Everything for you through this lens of power.
It won't work, btw. It is obvious you came here as an outlet for your anger. But you are blind to the one place you could actually go to alleviate it.
You are going to fit in just fine.
Freon
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Post by freonbale on Aug 11, 2020 22:32:30 GMT
It's about decency, nothing more.
Do you even have values?
Freon
Decency, respect for others, yes. But striving to avoid all offence is impossible. The opportunity for offence is infinite. Who is advocating a cessation of all offense? Not me. But if there are wrongs that can be easily righted, why not volunteer to do so.
That's what I mean by decency. It's about common courtesy, about doing unto others.
But, that is just my opinion. If you all prefer being dicks, there is nothing stopping you. I find your reasons for being this way fascinating.
Freon
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petep
Legend
Posts: 26,031
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Post by petep on Aug 11, 2020 22:36:17 GMT
We all need to let Freon continue his virtue signaling campaign.
Every post is always about how great he is and how despicable everyone else is
As he lectures us all on the importance of not judging.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 11, 2020 22:41:09 GMT
Not at all, Freon. I assume that the courtesy and respect that I typically display at an initial meeting will be reciprocated. That's a start, but that's all.
Respect doesn't require full agreement, but it does require maturity, honesty, intelligence and common sense from both parties.
Whining like a spoiled brat because someone says a disliked word or phrase will not engender respect (oh my, can I say "engender" without getting cancelled??).
So was I not supposed to challenge the people who used the word 'Jew' as a verb? They were not being racist, that is, they were not trying to demean me, they just grew up with a word in their lexicon that I happen to find offensive.
By your reasoning, I was in the wrong by getting offended. I was being too sensitive. How is it different from 'blacklisting', or 'blackballing'?
Freon
We all are offended by something, and some of us by many things. But your "blacklist" and "blackball" examples have nothing to do with race at all, yet they have been perverted simply because they contain the word black.
Sometimes, these are just words. Even you admitted that "jew" wasn't meant as a pejorative; accept the innocent intentions behind it and move on.
We use words like "hysterical" all of the time without realizing their origins and without intending any disreputable meaning. Hysterical comes from the Greek word for uterus. "Gay" also had a different meaning once.
If one intends to be a perpetual snowflake, at least stick to the most egregious offenses rather than every tiny perceived slight.
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petep
Legend
Posts: 26,031
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Post by petep on Aug 11, 2020 22:41:43 GMT
I especially like his fairy tales about threesomes
You have this image of that little Jewish kid in 40 year old virgin, typing away in his laptop in his parents basement, with an old penthouse he found at his grandfathers by his side.
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Post by freonbale on Aug 11, 2020 23:46:32 GMT
I especially like his fairy tales about threesomes You have this image of that little Jewish kid in 40 year old virgin, typing away in his laptop in his parents basement, with an old penthouse he found at his grandfathers by his side. I appreciate both of your responses. They were informative. Freon |
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Post by Mercy for All on Aug 12, 2020 0:06:03 GMT
Who is advocating a cessation of all offense? Not me. That's good. Some people are sensitive to "micro-aggressions," the definition of which can be notoriously particular. Absolutely. There is a point where "if you are a white man, just sit down and shut up, and line up with what everyone else is saying" goes too far. And yes, that has been said by some. If it were only that simple. It also can require sincerely listening to those who are different from you, as well as avoiding the confidence that your own experience is the same as everyone else's. Who is the "you"? Are you generalizing again? |
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Post by Mercy for All on Aug 12, 2020 0:18:32 GMT
Everything for you through this lens of power.
It won't work, btw. It is obvious you came here as an outlet for your anger. But you are blind to the one place you could actually go to alleviate it.
You are going to fit in just fine.
Freon
Much of the narrative of the left is from the perspective of power. I suspect this can be traced back to Nietzsche, who postulated that with the eradication of "God-based values," the only value left was power. His perspective has been distorted by the likes of Foucault, who described and evaluated every possible human interaction along the lines of power--its use, abuse, and the differential, not so much between individuals than between people groups. Demonstrably, power is not the only possible type of interaction between humans. There is also mutual benefit, cooperation, friendship, etc. I had a really bad "power conversation" about racism once (read: "systemic racism"--that was apparently the default definition of the term in the conversation, which I found out the hard way). I suggested that "power" is not the best lens for interacting with one another; love is--the metric suggested by Jesus (of course). Love is not sappy emotionalism. In contrast to our "modern objectivity and categorization," love accepts a person or thing as it is, not according to a set of generalizations and categories in which it must be forced. That is part of the mistake of today's postmodern leftism. To categorize and individual according to some set of group characteristics (e.g., skin colour, gender, etc.) itself is arguably an inappropriate use of power and demeaning of an individual. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2020 0:52:57 GMT
I work on the IT side of medical research, and we are currently in discussions of how we can make ourselves more racially aware and considerate.
One simple example is when referring to drives in a computer, they are listed as a master drive and a slave drive. Or we will often slave an array to a different controller. It's used fairly often to refer to dependent systems (which may be the word we turn to).
It never even occurred to me that this would be an issue, but turns out, really offends the black members of the team.
No biggie to change it, but it got me thinking there are likely other examples in other disciplines.
What examples are you aware of?
Thanks,
Freon
Maybe we can just be happy that racism is so close to eradication that we have to find obscure examples of words that might remind us of slavery in order to reignite hatred of racism. |
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bama beau
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Fish will piss anywhere. They just live in water.
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Post by bama beau on Aug 12, 2020 0:59:51 GMT
I work on the IT side of medical research, and we are currently in discussions of how we can make ourselves more racially aware and considerate.
One simple example is when referring to drives in a computer, they are listed as a master drive and a slave drive. Or we will often slave an array to a different controller. It's used fairly often to refer to dependent systems (which may be the word we turn to).
It never even occurred to me that this would be an issue, but turns out, really offends the black members of the team.
No biggie to change it, but it got me thinking there are likely other examples in other disciplines.
What examples are you aware of?
Thanks,
Freon
Maybe we can just be happy that racism is so close to eradication that we have to find obscure examples of words that might remind us of slavery in order to reignite hatred of racism. If only that was true. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2020 1:00:35 GMT
Maybe we can just be happy that racism is so close to eradication that we have to find obscure examples of words that might remind us of slavery in order to reignite hatred of racism. If only that was true. It is, we just saw an example of it. |
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