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Post by Deleted on Jul 22, 2020 21:45:40 GMT
"Proactively arresting people" is what we do with terrorists, no? Arrest them before the damage is done?
If we had credible intelligence of the 9/11 attackers should we not have picked them up? Gotta wait for them to actually commit a crime first? We typically don't arrest people - proactively or otherwise - without probable cause. There isn't a tower of rationalizations. It comes down to: they didn't have probable cause for the arrest. Seems so quaint to be discussing this and trying to get worked up about it while governors are busily destroying people's lives and careers with nobody even considering "due process" or "probable cause." While the governor of California organizes a county "strike force" to monitor businesses and people to ensure they're complying with the governor's edicts from on high. It makes this discussion seem irrelevant and useless. At least kids running around wearing black in the middle of the night breaking shit did something to justify the state response. What did the owner of "Ethel's Knick Knacks" do? San Diego County businesses defy second shutdown order; county strike force mobilizes - LA Times - July 17, 2020At the beginning of the month, Gov. Gavin Newsom announced the creation of teams from 10 state agencies creation of teams from 10 state agencies that would be tasked with enforcing regulations imposed during the pandemic. On Thursday, county officials confirmed that these teams are actively operating in the region.
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Post by MojoJojo on Jul 22, 2020 21:51:42 GMT
This is exactly why he's overstepping his authority, to cater to ^this^ view. It's not about the destruction! of federal buildings, or even private property...this is about keeping the base worked up a few months before the election. Do you think Democrats' coddling and manipulating the narrative around these is any different? They're hoping to channel and ride that "worked up" base of theirs to victory in November. And for the thread at large ... it's awfully hard to get worked up about this ... a perfectly normal activity for our federal government (does nobody remember the 50s and 60s??) ... while not getting worked up by the abuses to civil liberties and the Constitution being perpetrated by our state governors *daily.* THOSE are unprecedented abuses. And yet people freaking out about federal officers rounding up kids dressed in black running around in the middle of the night destroying federal property all seem perfectly okay with that. Mind....blown. But ... not surprised leftist will eat whatever bullshit the media spoonfeeds them at this point. Kinda been warning about it for a few years now. Just hard to take the selective outrage seriously. Queshank Well of course the Dems are playing this for all it's worth, this is politics and the pursuit of power. Trump is handing them the keys to the White House with actions like this. Do YOU think he cares about the federal buildings and private property being vandalized? Be honest. This is what he's sown with three and a half years of purposeful division. Just like with his careless LIBERATE! bullshit, he's going hard partisan politics, over something he probably doesn't even care about, in an effort at re-election. Your observations and commentary overstate the role of media and understate the role of the POTUS. He always gets an out while the vast left wing conspiracy just gets more entrenched. Even when he says crazy shit, it's the media's fault for setting him up, misreporting it and otherwise being fake. I watch and listen to what he says. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 22, 2020 22:19:15 GMT
Do you think Democrats' coddling and manipulating the narrative around these is any different? They're hoping to channel and ride that "worked up" base of theirs to victory in November. And for the thread at large ... it's awfully hard to get worked up about this ... a perfectly normal activity for our federal government (does nobody remember the 50s and 60s??) ... while not getting worked up by the abuses to civil liberties and the Constitution being perpetrated by our state governors *daily.* THOSE are unprecedented abuses. And yet people freaking out about federal officers rounding up kids dressed in black running around in the middle of the night destroying federal property all seem perfectly okay with that. Mind....blown. But ... not surprised leftist will eat whatever bullshit the media spoonfeeds them at this point. Kinda been warning about it for a few years now. Just hard to take the selective outrage seriously. Queshank Well of course the Dems are playing this for all it's worth, this is politics and the pursuit of power. Trump is handing them the keys to the White House with actions like this. Do YOU think he cares about the federal buildings and private property being vandalized? Be honest. This is what he's sown with three and a half years of purposeful division. Just like with his careless LIBERATE! bullshit, he's going hard partisan politics, over something he probably doesn't even care about, in an effort at re-election. Your observations and commentary overstate the role of media and understate the role of the POTUS. He always gets an out while the vast left wing conspiracy just gets more entrenched. Even when he says crazy shit, it's the media's fault for setting him up, misreporting it and otherwise being fake. I watch and listen to what he says. "I watch and listen to what he says." Okay. Great. What's the most egregious thing he's "said." And then tell me why I should give a shit. Because does it matter as much as what he does? Is this thread an example of the worst thing he's done? Because this isn't unprecedented. In fact, in the past 50 to 60 years ... it's actually pretty common. And yet here people are getting worked up about it as if Democratic governors weren't doing far worse on the daily. THAT is what our media has accomplished. You think I'm overstating it? You're proving it in real time. Queshank |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 22, 2020 22:22:08 GMT
And btw ... I think Democrats normalizing these riots and the behavior of these "legitimate" protesters are handing Trump "the keys" to a second term. I'll explain more as the thread progresses. I'm seeing a lot more support for putting the protestors and rioters down than I am outrage over police rounding up protestors. It's not exactly an unusual move for police depts whether city, state or federal.
Do you think the Democrats actually care about black people or are just harnessing and trying to manipulate this manufactured outrage? If you do think they care... they've had a few decades of running all of these police depts and cities that are rioting to prove it. Where've they been?
Queshank
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Odysseus
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Post by Odysseus on Jul 23, 2020 0:04:59 GMT
If force must be used it should be used in a transparent and lawful way. Your question almost contains within it the suggestion that we must gas and beat peaceful people in order to deal with violent protestors. No. My method would be to identify and shoot the violent protesters, vandals and looters on the spot. Gas wouldn’t need to be involved. And seriously, “transparent and lawful way”? Are these violent protesters, looters and vandals being transparent and lawful? Like I said, you fight fire with fire.
Why not subcontract it out?
This way you could get the death(s) you desire without getting your hair and clothing all mussed up.
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demos
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Post by demos on Jul 23, 2020 13:07:11 GMT
Seems so quaint to be discussing this and trying to get worked up about it while governors are busily destroying people's lives and careers with nobody even considering "due process" or "probable cause." While the governor of California organizes a county "strike force" to monitor businesses and people to ensure they're complying with the governor's edicts from on high. It's all part of the same over-policing problem imo. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 23, 2020 14:49:09 GMT
Seems so quaint to be discussing this and trying to get worked up about it while governors are busily destroying people's lives and careers with nobody even considering "due process" or "probable cause." While the governor of California organizes a county "strike force" to monitor businesses and people to ensure they're complying with the governor's edicts from on high. It's all part of the same over-policing problem imo.
IMO too. Like I said at the outset. "This is as bad as..."
To dovetail with other points I'm always making (because it's the shadow behind every point every one of us always makes here) ... do our media outlets present it that way?
Can you even find a national news outlet besides Fox News and the LA Times reporting on it?
Queshank
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demos
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Post by demos on Jul 23, 2020 15:00:01 GMT
Can you even find a national news outlet besides Fox News and the LA Times reporting on it?
Queshank
Probably not. I don't think anyone really reported that the City of Austin was recommending calling 911 ( seriously) on people who aren't wearing masks. If you've seen the videos of police handling people not wearing masks, you can understand why that would be a problem, especially in the current environment. And the city recommended this even as it voted to reallocate police funds (which I support btw); clueless. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 23, 2020 15:32:14 GMT
Can you even find a national news outlet besides Fox News and the LA Times reporting on it?
Queshank
Probably not. I don't think anyone really reported that the City of Austin was recommending calling 911 ( seriously) on people who aren't wearing masks. If you've seen the videos of police handling people not wearing masks, you can understand why that would be a problem, especially in the current environment. And the city recommended this even as it voted to reallocate police funds (which I support btw); clueless. This is the most interesting response in that City of Austin thread, *by* the City of Austin to a question...
Hi Daniel, we encourage businesses to make other options available to people who can't or won't wear a mask, like curbside pick-up or delivery. Businesses have a right to refuse service to those who do not comply with the Orders.
"Businesses have a right to refuse service to those who do not comply with the Orders"
If a person can read that without gagging a little they've got a problem. If a person can read that and still share a meme about "no shirt no shoes no service" they probably couldn't pass the Montreal Cognitive Assessment test.
Queshank
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bama beau
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Post by bama beau on Jul 23, 2020 15:37:44 GMT
Probably not. I don't think anyone really reported that the City of Austin was recommending calling 911 ( seriously) on people who aren't wearing masks. If you've seen the videos of police handling people not wearing masks, you can understand why that would be a problem, especially in the current environment. And the city recommended this even as it voted to reallocate police funds (which I support btw); clueless. This is the most interesting response in that City of Austin thread, *by* the City of Austin to a question...
Hi Daniel, we encourage businesses to make other options available to people who can't or won't wear a mask, like curbside pick-up or delivery. Businesses have a right to refuse service to those who do not comply with the Orders.
"Businesses have a right to refuse service to those who do not comply with the Orders"
If a person can read that without gagging a little they've got a problem. If a person can read that and still share a meme about "no shirt no shoes no service" they probably couldn't pass the Montreal Cognitive Assessment test.
Queshank
But what if the person refusing to wear the mask is gay, and is there only to pick up his wedding cake? |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 23, 2020 15:42:49 GMT
This is the most interesting response in that City of Austin thread, *by* the City of Austin to a question...
Hi Daniel, we encourage businesses to make other options available to people who can't or won't wear a mask, like curbside pick-up or delivery. Businesses have a right to refuse service to those who do not comply with the Orders.
"Businesses have a right to refuse service to those who do not comply with the Orders"
If a person can read that without gagging a little they've got a problem. If a person can read that and still share a meme about "no shirt no shoes no service" they probably couldn't pass the Montreal Cognitive Assessment test.
Queshank
But what if the person refusing to wear the mask is gay, and is there only to pick up his wedding cake?
Did that string of nonsense thrown together make sense when you typed it?
Let me ask you Bama ... do you not realize "No shirts no shoes no service" was born in the 50s/60s as conservative pushback against poor blacks who couldn't afford shoes in rural communities and hippie counterculture in urban areas?
Queshank
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bama beau
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Post by bama beau on Jul 23, 2020 15:49:50 GMT
But what if the person refusing to wear the mask is gay, and is there only to pick up his wedding cake?
Did that string of nonsense thrown together make sense when you typed it?
Let me ask you Bama ... do you not realize "No shirts no shoes no service" was born in the 50s/60s as conservative pushback against poor blacks who couldn't afford shoes in rural communities and hippie counterculture in urban areas?
Queshank
All I did was ask a question. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 23, 2020 15:53:09 GMT
Did that string of nonsense thrown together make sense when you typed it?
Let me ask you Bama ... do you not realize "No shirts no shoes no service" was born in the 50s/60s as conservative pushback against poor blacks who couldn't afford shoes in rural communities and hippie counterculture in urban areas?
Queshank
All I did was ask a question. Oh well in that case.
Of course a business cannot refuse to sell to a gay man who isn't wearing a mask. The City of Austin will likely shut that business down ... if they haven't already.
We're seeing evidence of that play out all across the nation. If you're artificially woke you get a free get out of jail free card for "noncompliance" with Orders. In fact if you're artificially woke, it is *you* that are in charge.
And the feds better not make you angry. They wouldn't like you when you're angry. You might break a window or spray paint a building. Or shoot some young black kid.
Queshank
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AmericanMom
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Post by AmericanMom on Jul 23, 2020 16:47:25 GMT
No, he’s sounding like me. You can’t approve of violent tactics from one side, then complain when the other side fights fire with fire. Civil war, remember? We can deal with violent protestors without secret police and gestapo tactics, and without interfering with legitimate protest. Your approach all but guarantees an escalation of violence. Responsible folks generally want to de-escalate. You and Trump are in a class all your own (one that is profoundly illiberal). We can, the problem is the leadership of these States and cities (Portland and Mayor Ted Wheeler) have given space for the protesters, if anyone thinks this just started a few weeks ago is sadly mistaken, Antifa made a home in Portland because they were allowed, even welcomed. They have terrorized that city for several years. To blame this on Trump, saying he escalated this is far far from the actual truth. The protesters turned their attention from statues to Federal buildings and thus garnered a Federal response. I watched the train wreck last night in real time as Wheeler decided to come out and "stand with" the protesters. The images I witnessed were far removed from what the MSM is reporting today.. I said it on the other forum and I'll say it here.. The Media isnt telling you THE story, they are telling you A story. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 23, 2020 16:50:08 GMT
We can deal with violent protestors without secret police and gestapo tactics, and without interfering with legitimate protest. Your approach all but guarantees an escalation of violence. Responsible folks generally want to de-escalate. You and Trump are in a class all your own (one that is profoundly illiberal). We can, the problem is the leadership of these States and cities (Portland and Mayor Ted Wheeler) have given space for the protesters, if anyone thinks this just started a few weeks ago is sadly mistaken, Antifa made a home in Portland because they were allowed, even welcomed. They have terrorized that city for several years. To blame this on Trump, saying he escalated this is far far from the actual truth. The protesters turned their attention from statues to Federal buildings and thus garnered a Federal response. I watched the train wreck last night in real time as Wheeler decided to come out and "stand with" the protesters. The images I witnessed were far removed from what the MSM is reporting today.. I said it on the other forum and I'll say it here.. The Media isnt telling you THE story, they are telling you A story. I agree with you about the media. Just read a Foxnews article about the Portland Mom's and there wasn't a single word about them being gassed or shoved. |
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AmericanMom
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Post by AmericanMom on Jul 23, 2020 17:01:54 GMT
We can, the problem is the leadership of these States and cities (Portland and Mayor Ted Wheeler) have given space for the protesters, if anyone thinks this just started a few weeks ago is sadly mistaken, Antifa made a home in Portland because they were allowed, even welcomed. They have terrorized that city for several years. To blame this on Trump, saying he escalated this is far far from the actual truth. The protesters turned their attention from statues to Federal buildings and thus garnered a Federal response. I watched the train wreck last night in real time as Wheeler decided to come out and "stand with" the protesters. The images I witnessed were far removed from what the MSM is reporting today.. I said it on the other forum and I'll say it here.. The Media isnt telling you THE story, they are telling you A story. I agree with you about the media. Just read a Foxnews article about the Portland Mom's and there wasn't a single word about them being gassed or shoved. You do realize they were actors...acting right? seriously..... A story...not THE story |
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demos
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Post by demos on Jul 23, 2020 17:02:13 GMT
To blame this on Trump, saying he escalated this is far far from the actual truth. The protesters turned their attention from statues to Federal buildings and thus garnered a Federal response. , so their presence and actions have certainly escalated things. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 23, 2020 17:04:13 GMT
I agree with you about the media. Just read a Foxnews article about the Portland Mom's and there wasn't a single word about them being gassed or shoved. You do realize they were actors...acting right? seriously..... A story...not THE story Oh geez. You're funny. |
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AmericanMom
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Post by AmericanMom on Jul 23, 2020 17:11:00 GMT
To blame this on Trump, saying he escalated this is far far from the actual truth. The protesters turned their attention from statues to Federal buildings and thus garnered a Federal response. , so their presence and actions have certainly escalated things. Well gosh durn it.. When they moved to attack federal buildings and were met with force and not the coddling they were used too I'm sure that might have given rise to a few thinking they could use the optics for their own good, the media played right along. It isnt working BTW.. Oregonians are pissed and want these rioters brought to heel..or wall off Portland.. either way works lol |
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Post by MojoJojo on Jul 23, 2020 17:15:57 GMT
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