freonbale
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Stop telling me I'm awesome. I already know.
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Post by freonbale on Apr 4, 2024 16:57:52 GMT
Now what happens when a person who believes in one deity, prays for someone who believes in a different, or opposing deity? You are assuming the opposite of the faithful, is the atheist (which shows you don't understand that atheism requires its own faith to believe), but the opposite could very well be a competing theism. Freon
Atheism requires no faith.
A baby is an atheist. They don't even have a concept of faith.
No, a baby is not an atheist. That require knowledge of a belief in a deity, and the choice not to do so. An atheist KNOWS their is no deity. They believe they have empirical evidence of it, when that evidence is not actually possible, given our limited understanding of the universe. Even astrophysicists do not know what came before the initial expansion, so even they would direct you to theology as a possible explanation. Point being that it is impossible to KNOW there are no deities, therefore by the very definition of the word faith (belief, without proof), atheism is as much a faith as any theism. Freon
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Post by queshank on Apr 4, 2024 16:58:18 GMT
Atheism requires no faith.
A baby is an atheist. They don't even have a concept of faith.
Atheism requires a kind of faith. Do you have no faith whatsoever? If not, why would you bother posting on this forum?
I think this is a misread on the idea of faith.
Atheism doesn't require a kind of faith. Being a functional adult human requires a kind of faith.
Faith that when you call 911, the police are answering. Faith in government. Faith in institutions. Faith in your spouse that s/he actually does love you when they say "I love you."
I think you're referencing the fact that atheists simply realign their faith to those a-religious systems.
An atheist and a Christian have exactly the same amount of faith. Because they're both humans. And both easily led astray by that faith.
Queshank
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Post by Mercy for All on Apr 4, 2024 16:59:33 GMT
Atheism requires a kind of faith. Do you have no faith whatsoever? If not, why would you bother posting on this forum?
I think this is a misread on the idea of faith.
Atheism doesn't require a kind of faith. Being a functional adult human requires a kind of faith.
Okay, I'll concede that.
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Post by queshank on Apr 4, 2024 16:59:41 GMT
What kind? What do I need faith to post on a forum?
You have an unprovable foundational belief that posting here will: - Be seen and read (and understood, for that matter)
- Be engaged with (unless you are presuming to have the last word on the matter)
- Make some kind of difference or have some kind of impact.
Else, why do it?
"Faith" does not mean "unprovable/irrational belief in the supernatural."
I'm pretty sure that the U.S. Marines don't go into battle under the mantra of "maintain an irrational belief in the supernatural" (semper fi).
Everybody has faith. Without it, you wouldn't get up in the morning, or eat, or get an education, or read a book, or pursue a career, or buy a house...or post something on an online forum. Faith is a commitment demonstrated by a course of action—an allegiance to a person or ideal. The concept is not "inherently religious"; that's an erroneous Enlightenment construct that posited "faith" against "reason."
I see we're on the same page after all. Disregard my prior post.
Queshank
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freonbale
Legend
Stop telling me I'm awesome. I already know.
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Post by freonbale on Apr 4, 2024 17:01:40 GMT
Then the question for you in particular would be, why do you assume everyone looks at prayer and its sentiment the same way you do? Freon That question is irrelevant to his post. For him to appreciate the sentiment does require the assumption that "everyone looks at prayer and its sentiment they same way he does." It is irrelevant to you, because you are biased towards everyone viewing prayer in a positive way. Would you share your prayer sentiment to someone who you KNEW was opposed to prayer and to deity belief? I would consider that EXTREMELY rude, if you did. Freon
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petep
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Hospital
Apr 4, 2024 17:01:56 GMT
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Post by petep on Apr 4, 2024 17:01:56 GMT
Then the question for you in particular would be, why do you assume everyone looks at prayer and its sentiment the same way you do? Freon That question is irrelevant to his post. For him to appreciate the sentiment does require the assumption that "everyone looks at prayer and its sentiment they same way he does." That’s accurate. I’m speaking for myself. Someone else in my shoes may see it all different. So what.
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Post by Mercy for All on Apr 4, 2024 17:35:43 GMT
That question is irrelevant to his post. For him to appreciate the sentiment does require the assumption that "everyone looks at prayer and its sentiment they same way he does." It is irrelevant to you, because you are biased towards everyone viewing prayer in a positive way. Would you share your prayer sentiment to someone who you KNEW was opposed to prayer and to deity belief? I would consider that EXTREMELY rude, if you did. Freon What matters is if it's relevant to petep or not.
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Post by Monster Man on Apr 4, 2024 17:42:16 GMT
That question is irrelevant to his post. For him to appreciate the sentiment does require the assumption that "everyone looks at prayer and its sentiment they same way he does." It is irrelevant to you, because you are biased towards everyone viewing prayer in a positive way. Would you share your prayer sentiment to someone who you KNEW was opposed to prayer and to deity belief? I would consider that EXTREMELY rude, if you did. Freon This whole thread is really amazing. Folks are more upset about prayer than their own behavior on here.
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thor
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Post by thor on Apr 4, 2024 17:49:10 GMT
Now what happens when a person who believes in one deity, prays for someone who believes in a different, or opposing deity? You are assuming the opposite of the faithful, is the atheist (which shows you don't understand that atheism requires its own faith to believe), but the opposite could very well be a competing theism. Freon I once had a Jewish friend and Muslim friend visit me at the same time when I was in the hospital getting chemo. They each said they say a prayer for me to their respective dieties. I thanked them for their thoughts. And at the time 3 months into chemo and 125 pounds I’d take whatever I could get. Even an atheist saying hope you start feeling better. Why would I care what someone else thinks. I’d appreciate the sentiment. PP invents another bullshit story, Film at 11.
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freonbale
Legend
Stop telling me I'm awesome. I already know.
Posts: 19,780
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Post by freonbale on Apr 4, 2024 18:03:19 GMT
It is irrelevant to you, because you are biased towards everyone viewing prayer in a positive way. Would you share your prayer sentiment to someone who you KNEW was opposed to prayer and to deity belief? I would consider that EXTREMELY rude, if you did. Freon What matters is if it's relevant to petep or not. Why are you not willing to answer my question? Does it force you to face a reality that you find uncomfortable? Freon
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Post by MojoJojo on Apr 4, 2024 18:06:27 GMT
The reverse placebo effect? There's a name for that: the nocebo effect. Thank you sir!
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freonbale
Legend
Stop telling me I'm awesome. I already know.
Posts: 19,780
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Post by freonbale on Apr 4, 2024 18:16:43 GMT
It is irrelevant to you, because you are biased towards everyone viewing prayer in a positive way. Would you share your prayer sentiment to someone who you KNEW was opposed to prayer and to deity belief? I would consider that EXTREMELY rude, if you did. Freon This whole thread is really amazing. Folks are more upset about prayer than their own behavior on here. I'm glad you are reading it. Freon
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Post by Lomelis on Apr 4, 2024 18:16:50 GMT
I had a stroke at 1100 today. Posting from the specialist unit. Lost use of right leg. Sounds like you are doing better. You can always grow a new leg, tis but a scratch. And I have prayed to Trump for DaveJabo's salvation on your behalf while holding my American flag Trump bible.
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Odysseus
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Trump=Chump
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Post by Odysseus on Apr 4, 2024 18:20:41 GMT
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Post by Monster Man on Apr 4, 2024 18:24:16 GMT
What matters is if it's relevant to petep or not. Why are you not willing to answer my question? Does it force you to face a reality that you find uncomfortable? Freon Is this some projection, as to why you don't answer a lot of questions here, because you might face a reality you find uncomfortable?
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Post by Mercy for All on Apr 4, 2024 18:56:03 GMT
What matters is if it's relevant to petep or not. Why are you not willing to answer my question? Does it force you to face a reality that you find uncomfortable? Freon I might share my intent to pray for someone whom I knew was opposed to prayer and belief in deity. But if I did, I would do it playfully. You read way too much in my lack of response to what I deemed was a "somewhat irrelevant question."
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Post by Mercy for All on Apr 4, 2024 18:57:29 GMT
The real question is why it exists. There is no evolutionary benefit.
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Post by Mercy for All on Apr 4, 2024 18:58:30 GMT
I'm glad so many are willing to protect limey2 from the inappropriate and insulting onslaught of prayer on his behalf.
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Post by Monster Man on Apr 4, 2024 19:14:08 GMT
I'm glad so many are willing to protect limey 2 from the inappropriate and insulting onslaught of prayer on his behalf. Its comical, but also a sad reflection of some of the outright hateful underbelly of anti-religion bigotry on this forum.
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Post by DaveJavu on Apr 4, 2024 19:59:29 GMT
What kind? What do I need faith to post on a forum?
You have an unprovable foundational belief that posting here will: - Be seen and read (and understood, for that matter)
- Be engaged with (unless you are presuming to have the last word on the matter)
- Make some kind of difference or have some kind of impact.
Else, why do it?
"Faith" does not mean "unprovable/irrational belief in the supernatural."
I'm pretty sure that the U.S. Marines don't go into battle under the mantra of "maintain an irrational belief in the supernatural" (semper fi).
Everybody has faith. Without it, you wouldn't get up in the morning, or eat, or get an education, or read a book, or pursue a career, or buy a house...or post something on an online forum. Faith is a commitment demonstrated by a course of action—an allegiance to a person or ideal. The concept is not "inherently religious"; that's an erroneous Enlightenment construct that posited "faith" against "reason." I strongly disagree with all this.
Why do I post here. Because it amuses me and it's a distraction.
There is a small chance that this could be some kind of deception, but if so then it's a very good one and if it is a deception and no one sees my posting then what of it? I have lost nothing and got the same amount of distraction, nothing's changed about that, of course if it is a deception and I find out, I am gonna stop posting because I need that at least as a possibility to be motivated. No faith here.
You know you could argue solipsism if you will and it would be basically the same as what you are doing...It's always a possibility and if so then what? What have I lost?
You don't need the thing you call faith to be alive and well and to do whatever you want to do.
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