petep
Legend
Posts: 23,419
|
Post by petep on Jan 26, 2023 1:12:29 GMT
And training for ukraine?
|
|
|
Post by Greg55_99 on Jan 26, 2023 2:56:13 GMT
Jobs for American workers.
Greg
|
|
|
Post by runswithscissors on Jan 26, 2023 4:06:46 GMT
Gee, I remember when Republicans were bashing Obama for NOT sending more weapons to Ukraine and cheering trump for sending Javelin missiles. Now the right wing whiners are whining about Biden sending weapons to Ukraine. It just goes to show, they will whine no matter what. It's what they do. Hell, if the best possible outcome occurred, they'd whine about it. And whine some more. Fucking idiots.
|
|
|
Post by Admin on Jan 26, 2023 4:28:13 GMT
And training for ukraine? I'm uncomfortably OK with it. Ukraine's on defense (who doesn't support the underdog?) and I am conditioned to view Russia (and Communism) as my boogieman enemy. Fuck Putin.
|
|
Odysseus
Legend
Trump=Chump
Posts: 39,224
|
Post by Odysseus on Jan 26, 2023 4:56:27 GMT
And training for ukraine? I'm uncomfortably OK with it. Ukraine's on defense (who doesn't support the underdog?) and I am conditioned to view Russia (and Communism) as my boogieman enemy. Fuck Putin.
1) Modern Russia rejected communism about three decades ago.
2) Putin is more of a Trump/Nationalist/Neo-Nazi than a communist.
3) I also support Ukraine.
|
|
|
Post by oldtrapper on Jan 26, 2023 5:00:36 GMT
And training for ukraine? Too little, too late. And the cowards that you helped to elect will try to stop it so Putin can kill more children, and win.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2023 13:15:07 GMT
"We're not going to send missiles" --- and then we do "We're not going to send tanks" --- and then we do "We're not going to send jet fighters" --- and the news this morning is pointing out we may at some point "We're not going to send troops" --- fill in the blanks
And at every step of the way the "Ukraine is winning! Russia is falling apart!" narrative doesn't even take enough of a pause to draw breath.
|
|
|
Post by Maestro on Jan 26, 2023 13:43:07 GMT
Gee, I remember when Republicans were bashing Obama for NOT sending more weapons to Ukraine and cheering trump for sending Javelin missiles. Now the right wing whiners are whining about Biden sending weapons to Ukraine. It just goes to show, they will whine no matter what. It's what they do. Hell, if the best possible outcome occurred, they'd whine about it. And whine some more. Fucking idiots. I don't remember the details of Obama's plan regarding the Ukraine, but the GOP has been pretty publicly divided on the use of force overseas since the end of the George W. Bush administration. What could be called the McCain wing of the party has been in pretty strong opposition with what could be called the Buchanan wing. Which makes it really easy to find hypocrisy by claiming "Republicans" opposed Obama and Biden on the use of force in the Ukraine, but supported Trump . Unless you can show it was the same Republicans going back and forth, switching their positions on whether or not we should be involved military, this memory of yours doesn't really mean much. Along those lines, did all Democrats consistently support Obama's, Trump's and Biden's use of force in the Ukraine?
|
|
|
Post by Monster Man on Jan 26, 2023 13:43:47 GMT
And training for ukraine? Too little, too late. And the cowards that you helped to elect will try to stop it so Putin can kill more children, and win. Are you sending this message from the front lines?
|
|
|
Post by runswithscissors on Jan 26, 2023 14:03:35 GMT
Gee, I remember when Republicans were bashing Obama for NOT sending more weapons to Ukraine and cheering trump for sending Javelin missiles. Now the right wing whiners are whining about Biden sending weapons to Ukraine. It just goes to show, they will whine no matter what. It's what they do. Hell, if the best possible outcome occurred, they'd whine about it. And whine some more. Fucking idiots. I don't remember the details of Obama's plan regarding the Ukraine, but the GOP has been pretty publicly divided on the use of force overseas since the end of the George W. Bush administration. What could be called the McCain wing of the party has been in pretty strong opposition with what could be called the Buchanan wing. Which makes it really easy to find hypocrisy by claiming "Republicans" opposed Obama and Biden on the use of force in the Ukraine, but supported Trump . Unless you can show it was the same Republicans going back and forth, switching their positions on whether or not we should be involved military, this memory of yours doesn't really mean much. Along those lines, did all Democrats consistently support Obama's, Trump's and Biden's use of force in the Ukraine? I remember trump bragging about how "I sent them Javelins; Obama sent them blankets." Maybe those aren't his exact words but it's the point trump wanted to make. We both know a damn lot of Republicans fell over themselves to align their positions with whatever trump said or did. So I can't name specifically any one Republican other than trump who has made a 180 on the Ukraine subject. So trump went from sending missiles to bragging how Putin is a "genius" for invading Ukraine. Those two stances are not what anyone would call complimentary; they are actually total opposites. If you don't think any other Republicans have changed their stance on the matter, that's fine. I think more than a few have waddled along with trump on it. Some of them have lately been making noise about how much this is costing. Whether that's supposed to be a rationale for opposing helping Ukraine is anybody's guess. I just find it amusing how trump and others have gone from one side to the other on this. I mean, you either stand up for defending democracy in other countries (a long stated position of the US) or you don't. I don't know if all Democrats supported Obama's policies. Or Biden's. I'd guess there are likely a few who didn't.
|
|
|
Post by archie on Jan 26, 2023 14:09:15 GMT
Jobs for American workers. Greg Yes Craig. I would like to see Ukraine and Russia stop the BS. BECAUSE you and I are paying for all that equipment sent to help. Deficit?
|
|
sokpupet
Legend
Go Dark Brandon!
Posts: 5,222
|
Post by sokpupet on Jan 26, 2023 14:40:49 GMT
The Ukrainian military are smart. They are determined. They are winning. Putin is evil. He won’t stop with Ukraine. I am for any and all to crush Putin. Hopefully, his illness will take him out and more sane minds can prevail.
|
|
demos
Legend
Posts: 8,044
|
Post by demos on Jan 26, 2023 14:46:30 GMT
And training for ukraine? Militarily probably won't mean much, because there are going to be more Leopards that require less training and it's going to take longer for the Abrams to get there. A lot also depends on how Ukraine actually uses the tanks on the battlefield.
Policy-wise it means a lot, because we reversed a decision even the U.S. military wasn't really on board with, and it shows that if pressed we'll give in. So now Ukraine is pressing for long-range missiles (while threatening the Kremlin) and F-16s (which will also take a long time to train).
|
|
demos
Legend
Posts: 8,044
|
Post by demos on Jan 26, 2023 14:49:06 GMT
Along those lines, did all Democrats consistently support Obama's, Trump's and Biden's use of force in the Ukraine? No, they did not, because the Democrats have some of the same divisions.
|
|
demos
Legend
Posts: 8,044
|
Post by demos on Jan 26, 2023 14:53:36 GMT
Jobs for American workers. Greg Maybe not:
While defense companies have experienced similar labor trends for jobs spanning multiple sectors nationwide, aerospace and defense firms have had issues attracting workers for high-tech positions as well as skilled laborers. ( Source)
This has been discussed since early last year and it doesn't seem like the situation has improved.
|
|
freonbale
Legend
Stop telling me I'm awesome. I already know.
Posts: 19,780
|
Post by freonbale on Jan 26, 2023 14:56:03 GMT
And training for ukraine? I am concerned, but approve. If history is any indicator, Russia will back down. And if they don't back down, their ONLY option is WMDs. If they use those, they have signed their own death warrant. The entire world will be against them. So the risk of escalation seems calculated, but low. Low, however, is still greater than zero. Freon
|
|
|
Post by Greg55_99 on Jan 26, 2023 16:13:10 GMT
|
|
demos
Legend
Posts: 8,044
|
Post by demos on Jan 26, 2023 16:40:45 GMT
^ Not sure how you interpret that as jobs for Americans.
Goes more to my earlier point that about how long its going to be before you see these in Ukraine.
|
|
|
Post by Greg55_99 on Jan 26, 2023 16:46:55 GMT
^ Not sure how you interpret that as jobs for Americans. Goes more to my earlier point that about how long its going to be before you see these in Ukraine. They've got to be rebuilt someplace. That would be over here. Greg
|
|
demos
Legend
Posts: 8,044
|
Post by demos on Jan 26, 2023 16:49:08 GMT
They've got to be rebuilt someplace. That would be over here. Greg Not creating new jobs or hiring more people though it doesn't seem like.
|
|