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Post by freonbale on Aug 3, 2020 16:16:28 GMT
Also, the problem with whites is over. It doesn't need to be fixed. It's already fixed. Slavery is over. But black animalism is still a problem, every day. That has not been fixed yet. So why are we supposed to keep going over a problem that has been fixed, and we're not supposed to talk at all about an ongoing problem that needs to be fixed? Could that kind of mentality be part of why blacks are so messed up? Wow, black animalism? Wonder how that compares to white supremacist stupidity. Freon |
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Post by freonbale on Aug 3, 2020 16:40:25 GMT
Wow, black animalism? Wonder how that compares to white supremacist stupidity. Freon Call me old-fashioned, but I do not think white children should be exposed to this kind of thing at a public park. It's nasty. Wait, is your argument that only black people raise their kids stupidly? Freon |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 3, 2020 20:21:58 GMT
With BLM going strong in this country, how can you really ask the question of if it was enough.It seems obvious that the answer is no. Reparations will never be enough. The appetite of these extortionists will never be sated; it would require a moral integrity that does not currently exist to end these constant demands for ever more and more. Once these predators finish the fresh meat tossed to them, they will turn without remorse on us again, looking either for more meat or looking at us as their dinner. This is about responsibility. If you are an American, then you inherit all that America is, bad and good. Just as you take pride in our finally getting American astronauts into space again, aboard American rockets launching from American soil, so too, we must accept our American past sins. Putting Japanese in concentration camps during WW2, which we finally financially compensated them for - en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internment_of_Japanese_Americans#:~:text=The%20legislation%20admitted%20that%20government,been%20interned%20and%20their%20heirs.), is a good example. I did not treat those Japanese as if they were the enemy, my government did, and that went against our constitution. The result was to make it right through compensation. Why is ending slavery without compensating the victims any different? The $20,000 compensation was paid to living survivors of the internment camps. If you want to find ex-slaves to compensate, have at it. And slavery did not go "against the Constitution" since it was legal right up until 1865; just as legal and just as controversial as abortion is today, and slavery was far less deadly to its victims. You might want to find a comparison that is less nonsensical. There is a far more pragmatic reason to compensate them. This issue is NEVER going away until we do. Blacks will always be able to claim that justice was never served, and they will continue to get angrier and angrier. They DESERVE to be compensated. They are not looking for handouts, but for justice. Freon Justice? Not hardly. Extortion is the more accurate term and WE are yet again the victims of that blackmail. But, for the sake of argument, let the scales of Justitia be our guide; let's see what the balance sheet actually shows. If we assign a societal cost for every instance of affirmative action, every welfare payment, every hour of law enforcement time chasing thugs (and LEOs dying at their hands), every life lost to the epidemic murder rate, every property and drug crime committed, as well as the degradation of whole neighborhoods overrun with gangsters, would we collectively owe any "reparations" at all? We'd likely be due a refund. That math doesn't even count the 360,000 Yankee soldiers that died during the War of Northern Aggression, though slavery's abolition was rarely their goal. Nor does it account for the real and symbolic things that have been done....monuments, museums, holidays and the election of an incompetent Chicago fool as president. Reparations won't work; such draconian measures will only deepen the hatred on both sides. |
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petep
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Post by petep on Aug 3, 2020 20:50:31 GMT
remember when obama was elected...once and for all, no more excuses for anyone...america elected a black president...
it only got worse...
giving one race preferential treatment as a matter of legislation or law, is a recipe for setting things back...
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Post by freonbale on Aug 3, 2020 21:09:23 GMT
With BLM going strong in this country, how can you really ask the question of if it was enough.It seems obvious that the answer is no. Reparations will never be enough. The appetite of these extortionists will never be sated; it would require a moral integrity that does not currently exist to end these constant demands for ever more and more. Once these predators finish the fresh meat tossed to them, they will turn without remorse on us again, looking either for more meat or looking at us as their dinner. This is about responsibility. If you are an American, then you inherit all that America is, bad and good. Just as you take pride in our finally getting American astronauts into space again, aboard American rockets launching from American soil, so too, we must accept our American past sins. Putting Japanese in concentration camps during WW2, which we finally financially compensated them for - en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internment_of_Japanese_Americans#:~:text=The%20legislation%20admitted%20that%20government,been%20interned%20and%20their%20heirs.), is a good example. I did not treat those Japanese as if they were the enemy, my government did, and that went against our constitution. The result was to make it right through compensation. Why is ending slavery without compensating the victims any different? The $20,000 compensation was paid to living survivors of the internment camps. If you want to find ex-slaves to compensate, have at it. And slavery did not go "against the Constitution" since it was legal right up until 1865; just as legal and just as controversial as abortion is today, and slavery was far less deadly to its victims. You might want to find a comparison that is less nonsensical. There is a far more pragmatic reason to compensate them. This issue is NEVER going away until we do. Blacks will always be able to claim that justice was never served, and they will continue to get angrier and angrier. They DESERVE to be compensated. They are not looking for handouts, but for justice. Freon Justice? Not hardly. Extortion is the more accurate term and WE are yet again the victims of that blackmail. But, for the sake of argument, let the scales of Justitia be our guide; let's see what the balance sheet actually shows. If we assign a societal cost for every instance of affirmative action, every welfare payment, every hour of law enforcement time chasing thugs (and LEOs dying at their hands), every life lost to the epidemic murder rate, every property and drug crime committed, as well as the degradation of whole neighborhoods overrun with gangsters, would we collectively owe any "reparations" at all? We'd likely be due a refund. That math doesn't even count the 360,000 Yankee soldiers that died during the War of Northern Aggression, though slavery's abolition was rarely their goal. Nor does it account for the real and symbolic things that have been done....monuments, museums, holidays and the election of an incompetent Chicago fool as president. Reparations won't work; such draconian measures will only deepen the hatred on both sides. How do you know? The ONE thing not tried is reparations, yet you are totally sure it will have no benefit.
I think you are projecting your own cynicism on them, and even more likely, you care so little about them, you don't want to foot the bill.
At least be honest.
Freon
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Post by freonbale on Aug 3, 2020 21:11:25 GMT
remember when obama was elected...once and for all, no more excuses for anyone...america elected a black president... it only got worse... giving one race preferential treatment as a matter of legislation or law, is a recipe for setting things back... Speak for yourself. I thought Obama was a fantastic president. Respected, classy, smart, educated, dignified.
And Trump cannot even claim one of those traits.
You prefer a rich boob as president, that's your call, but you are a minority.
Freon
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Post by stugatze on Aug 3, 2020 22:51:43 GMT
remember when obama was elected...once and for all, no more excuses for anyone...america elected a black president... it only got worse... giving one race preferential treatment as a matter of legislation or law, is a recipe for setting things back... __________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ Indeed, .. it DID get ''worse'' under Obongo, and that is because, .. that black bastard, and he was a bastard to be sure, BELIEVES strongly in racist black Marxist Liberation theology! -- Obongo WAS the greatest divider of people!  |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 4, 2020 3:32:34 GMT
Reparations will never be enough. The appetite of these extortionists will never be sated; it would require a moral integrity that does not currently exist to end these constant demands for ever more and more. Once these predators finish the fresh meat tossed to them, they will turn without remorse on us again, looking either for more meat or looking at us as their dinner. The $20,000 compensation was paid to living survivors of the internment camps. If you want to find ex-slaves to compensate, have at it. And slavery did not go "against the Constitution" since it was legal right up until 1865; just as legal and just as controversial as abortion is today, and slavery was far less deadly to its victims. You might want to find a comparison that is less nonsensical. Justice? Not hardly. Extortion is the more accurate term and WE are yet again the victims of that blackmail. But, for the sake of argument, let the scales of Justitia be our guide; let's see what the balance sheet actually shows. If we assign a societal cost for every instance of affirmative action, every welfare payment, every hour of law enforcement time chasing thugs (and LEOs dying at their hands), every life lost to the epidemic murder rate, every property and drug crime committed, as well as the degradation of whole neighborhoods overrun with gangsters, would we collectively owe any "reparations" at all? We'd likely be due a refund. That math doesn't even count the 360,000 Yankee soldiers that died during the War of Northern Aggression, though slavery's abolition was rarely their goal. Nor does it account for the real and symbolic things that have been done....monuments, museums, holidays and the election of an incompetent Chicago fool as president. Reparations won't work; such draconian measures will only deepen the hatred on both sides. How do you know? The ONE thing not tried is reparations, yet you are totally sure it will have no benefit.
I think you are projecting your own cynicism on them, and even more likely, you care so little about them, you don't want to foot the bill.
At least be honest.
Freon
Unlike most progressives, I'm always honest. And you have successfully stepped on your tongue by admitting that we've already tried everything but reparations (we've even handed out money to them without calling it reparations) and yet nothing has satisfied their lust for more.
Common sense would tell a normal person that it's just stupid to keep throwing money into the same cesspool, but naive little leftists are always eager to give away other people's money. I'd be fully supportive if radical progressives wanted to pool their funds and give it out to the black community, but the extortion of the entire country would be a mistake and lead to more division, not less. Penalizing folks who committed no offense is not a smart thing to do.
If an animal bites me after I've fed him steak every day, more steak probably won't help. Reparations is "forget the steak, I want the whole cow! Now!" But liberals have always lacked the perspicacity to recognize the evil in such things.
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Post by freonbale on Aug 4, 2020 13:02:22 GMT
How do you know? The ONE thing not tried is reparations, yet you are totally sure it will have no benefit.
I think you are projecting your own cynicism on them, and even more likely, you care so little about them, you don't want to foot the bill.
At least be honest.
Freon
Unlike most progressives, I'm always honest. And you have successfully stepped on your tongue by admitting that we've already tried everything but reparations (we've even handed out money to them without calling it reparations) and yet nothing has satisfied their lust for more.
Common sense would tell a normal person that it's just stupid to keep throwing money into the same cesspool, but naive little leftists are always eager to give away other people's money. I'd be fully supportive if radical progressives wanted to pool their funds and give it out to the black community, but the extortion of the entire country would be a mistake and lead to more division, not less. Penalizing folks who committed no offense is not a smart thing to do.
If an animal bites me after I've fed him steak every day, more steak probably won't help. Reparations is "forget the steak, I want the whole cow! Now!" But liberals have always lacked the perspicacity to recognize the evil in such things.
You are transparent. 'Penalizing folks who committed no offense is not a smart thing to do' = Nothing my country does is my responsibility.
This is where we disagree. I am saddened that there are Americans like you who do not believe in responsibility, and righting a wrong caused by our COUNTRY, not by individuals.
Freon
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Post by Deleted on Aug 4, 2020 14:35:34 GMT
Unlike most progressives, I'm always honest. And you have successfully stepped on your tongue by admitting that we've already tried everything but reparations (we've even handed out money to them without calling it reparations) and yet nothing has satisfied their lust for more.
Common sense would tell a normal person that it's just stupid to keep throwing money into the same cesspool, but naive little leftists are always eager to give away other people's money. I'd be fully supportive if radical progressives wanted to pool their funds and give it out to the black community, but the extortion of the entire country would be a mistake and lead to more division, not less. Penalizing folks who committed no offense is not a smart thing to do.
If an animal bites me after I've fed him steak every day, more steak probably won't help. Reparations is "forget the steak, I want the whole cow! Now!" But liberals have always lacked the perspicacity to recognize the evil in such things.
You are transparent. 'Penalizing folks who committed no offense is not a smart thing to do' = Nothing my country does is my responsibility.
This is where we disagree. I am saddened that there are Americans like you who do not believe in responsibility, and righting a wrong caused by our COUNTRY, not by individuals. Freon
And you are hilarious. You want to throw more undeserved money at a group that has repeatedly failed to take responsibility for their own self inflicted problems and yet dare to accuse someone else of shirking responsibility for refusing to bow to more extortion. What a joke. You know very well that personal responsibility is what conservatives have always stood for. Liberals, on the other hand, when they speak of "responsibility", like to pay their alleged "debts" using the money of others.
When the left takes responsibility for the slaughter of 60 million human beings since 1973, then we'll talk.
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Post by freonbale on Aug 4, 2020 14:37:28 GMT
You are transparent. 'Penalizing folks who committed no offense is not a smart thing to do' = Nothing my country does is my responsibility.
This is where we disagree. I am saddened that there are Americans like you who do not believe in responsibility, and righting a wrong caused by our COUNTRY, not by individuals. Freon
And you are hilarious. You want to throw more undeserved money at a group that has repeatedly failed to take responsibility for their own self inflicted problems and yet dare to accuse someone else of shirking responsibility for refusing to bow to more extortion. What a joke. You know very well that personal responsibility is what conservatives have always stood for. Liberals, on the other hand, when they speak of "responsibility", like to pay their alleged "debts" using the money of others.
When the left takes responsibility for the slaughter of 60 million human beings since 1973, then we'll talk.
How is being compensated for hundreds of years a slavery, UNDESERVED?
I can think of no group who MORE deserves that compensation then them.
Freon
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Post by Deleted on Aug 4, 2020 15:00:03 GMT
And you are hilarious. You want to throw more undeserved money at a group that has repeatedly failed to take responsibility for their own self inflicted problems and yet dare to accuse someone else of shirking responsibility for refusing to bow to more extortion. What a joke. You know very well that personal responsibility is what conservatives have always stood for. Liberals, on the other hand, when they speak of "responsibility", like to pay their alleged "debts" using the money of others.
When the left takes responsibility for the slaughter of 60 million human beings since 1973, then we'll talk.
How is being compensated for hundreds of years a slavery, UNDESERVED?
I can think of no group who MORE deserves that compensation then them.
Freon
Pay every slave that you can find. Compensation today is akin to paying me money because, 250 years ago, my Scottish ancestors were poor, persecuted or downtrodden. Should the British Empire have to pay me because my progenitors had to start over in America with little or nothing? By golly, they did undertake a dangerous sea journey to get here....by liberal "logic", I DESERVE COMPENSATION!
Do you "deserve" a payday if your great great grandfather was the victim of some travesty?
Again, if we want to take an objective look (and that's asking a lot from liberals, I know), that debt has been paid....likely overpaid.
If abortion was made illegal today, would you support payments to the families affected by this suddenly illegal practice? Would you keep paying for more than 150 years?
I know it's a novel concept in California, but use just a little common sense and you'll see that I'm right. I usually am.
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Post by Fiddler on Aug 4, 2020 15:01:52 GMT
remember when obama was elected...once and for all, no more excuses for anyone...america elected a black president... it only got worse...
Yes it did get worse .. Membership in neo-Confederate militias, Nazi and White Supremacist organizations skyrocketed.. Right-wing violence followed suit..
When the label was broadened from anti-fascists to left-wing violence, it found 21 victims had been killed since 2010, compared to 117 in right-wing violence in the same time period.
Antifa is in part a response to the far-right's increase in violence.
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Post by Fiddler on Aug 4, 2020 15:08:10 GMT
How is being compensated for hundreds of years a slavery, UNDESERVED?
I can think of no group who MORE deserves that compensation then them.
Freon
Pay every slave that you can find. Compensation today is akin to paying me money because, 250 years ago, my Scottish ancestors were poor, persecuted or downtrodden. Should the British Empire have to pay me because my progenitors had to start over in America with little or nothing? By golly, they did undertake a dangerous sea journey to get here....by liberal "logic", I DESERVE COMPENSATION!
I gather that by radical right "logic" (forgive the oxymoron) the freedom to "to start over in America with little or nothing" is just like the enslavement, forced labor, and broken families endured by slaves. ..
If only Civil War era Blacks had simply moved to a place of greater opportunity.. Wonder why they didn't do that..?
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Post by crepe05 on Aug 4, 2020 15:09:54 GMT
Is there anything which supports this claim? What would you like? It also is what I was taught in grade school, but no, I wasn't at any of the events of the time in the olden days. |
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Post by crepe05 on Aug 4, 2020 15:19:21 GMT
Pay every slave that you can find. Compensation today is akin to paying me money because, 250 years ago, my Scottish ancestors were poor, persecuted or downtrodden. Should the British Empire have to pay me because my progenitors had to start over in America with little or nothing? By golly, they did undertake a dangerous sea journey to get here....by liberal "logic", I DESERVE COMPENSATION!
I gather that by radical right "logic" (forgive the oxymoron) the freedom to "to start over in America with little or nothing" is just like the enslavement, forced labor, and broken families endured by slaves. ..
If only Civil War era Blacks had simply moved to a place of greater opportunity.. Wonder why they didn't do that..?
Some of then did move to " a place of greater opportunity". They ran away from the owners (always very dangerous to do) and by using the Underground Railroad and various help from Northern whites and sympathetic Southerners, moved to the Northern states where they were not slaves. They were extremely brave men and women. |
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demos
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Post by demos on Aug 4, 2020 15:51:24 GMT
What would you like? It also is what I was taught in grade school, but no, I wasn't at any of the events of the time in the olden days. Does no one read? I'm asking about the specific claim about the 1619 Project. I haven't read anything they've written, and I don't feel like going down that rabbit hole, so I'm asking if there is somewhere they've claimed that slavery was a uniquely American phenomenon. |
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Post by william on Aug 4, 2020 15:52:46 GMT
I gather that by radical right "logic" (forgive the oxymoron) the freedom to "to start over in America with little or nothing" is just like the enslavement, forced labor, and broken families endured by slaves. ..
If only Civil War era Blacks had simply moved to a place of greater opportunity.. Wonder why they didn't do that..?
Some of then did move to " a place of greater opportunity". They ran away from the owners (always very dangerous to do) and by using the Underground Railroad and various help from Northern whites and sympathetic Southerners, moved to the Northern states where they were not slaves. They were extremely brave men and women. and just which "Northern" states accepted runaway slaves as free men through the Underground Railroad? |
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petep
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Post by petep on Aug 4, 2020 15:56:06 GMT
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Post by Fiddler on Aug 4, 2020 17:02:31 GMT
I gather that by radical right "logic" (forgive the oxymoron) the freedom to "to start over in America with little or nothing" is just like the enslavement, forced labor, and broken families endured by slaves. ..
If only Civil War era Blacks had simply moved to a place of greater opportunity.. Wonder why they didn't do that..? Some of then did move to " a place of greater opportunity". They ran away from the owners (always very dangerous to do) and by using the Underground Railroad and various help from Northern whites and sympathetic Southerners, moved to the Northern states where they were not slaves. They were extremely brave men and women. So Honey .. You're saying that escaping slavery is the same as a free Scotsman gathering his family and moving to find opportunity.. |
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