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Post by DaveJavu on Nov 7, 2024 1:51:33 GMT
The allegory of the cave is always good for a few laughs. Ivory prisons and cave walls? Kind of a mixed metaphor. Whatever. I'm a reverse cave allegory guy. What are "shadows" to Plato is the everyday empirical world that most people know. I'll take that over his supposedly superior supernatural "forms." A very influential philosopher, but on occasion a silly twit. His influence has been mostly overblown by the Catholic Church... Ironically enough, his (popularity) stocks were linked to Christianity's, without it, he'd be a minor philosopher from that period of time. |
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Post by HolyMoly on Nov 7, 2024 2:49:47 GMT
The allegory of the cave is always good for a few laughs. Ivory prisons and cave walls? Kind of a mixed metaphor. Whatever. I'm a reverse cave allegory guy. What are "shadows" to Plato is the everyday empirical world that most people know. I'll take that over his supposedly superior supernatural "forms." A very influential philosopher, but on occasion a silly twit. His influence has been mostly overblown by the Catholic Church... Ironically enough, his (popularity) stocks were linked to Christianity's, without it, he'd be a minor philosopher from that period of time. IIRC, Aristotle was more influential than Plato on the medieval Catholic church. Whether they would have become as well known without the Christian connection is anyone's guess. I think they still might have been major philosophers, especially as they both left behind a large body of writings. |
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Post by queshank on Nov 7, 2024 4:24:52 GMT
What do you think I'm doing here besides being entertained by stupid people saying stupid things?
Listening to yourself talk? ? 
Well obviously. I've been scarce the past month cuz 1- I don't care and 2- I'm helping my wife's uncle with harvest as I tend to in the fall. And it's been raining. And they are learning a harsh lesson about combining wet sorghum.
So I'm bored. And yes. Listening to myself talk.
But more importantly .. I'm doing what I always do and listening to other people talk. Amazing and revealing stuff.
Queshank
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Post by queshank on Nov 7, 2024 4:26:39 GMT
The allegory of the cave is always good for a few laughs. Ivory prisons and cave walls? Kind of a mixed metaphor. Whatever. I'm a reverse cave allegory guy. What are "shadows" to Plato is the everyday empirical world that most people know. I'll take that over his supposedly superior supernatural "forms." A very influential philosopher, but on occasion a silly twit.
Ahahaha I hat tipped you because I love it when you give scholarly and opinionated dissertations on this subject that half of the world's philosophers disagree with you on.
The allegory of the cave works for the purposes I use it for. The shadows on the wall being made by people are not reality. And that's all the allegory means when you're not trying to get published. Or ... whatever weirdo thing it is you're doing. (Did you ever think weirdo was a good insult? God the democrats are dumb. It's almost a term of fucking endearment in todays lexicon ffs)
Queshank
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Post by queshank on Nov 7, 2024 5:16:53 GMT
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Post by HolyMoly on Nov 7, 2024 5:26:39 GMT
The allegory of the cave is always good for a few laughs. Ivory prisons and cave walls? Kind of a mixed metaphor. Whatever. I'm a reverse cave allegory guy. What are "shadows" to Plato is the everyday empirical world that most people know. I'll take that over his supposedly superior supernatural "forms." A very influential philosopher, but on occasion a silly twit.
Ahahaha I hat tipped you because I love it when you give scholarly and opinionated dissertations on this subject that half of the world's philosophers disagree with you on.
The allegory of the cave works for the purposes I use it for. The shadows on the wall being made by people are not reality. And that's all the allegory means when you're not trying to get published. Or ... whatever weirdo thing it is you're doing. (Did you ever think weirdo was a good insult? God the democrats are dumb. It's almost a term of fucking endearment in todays lexicon ffs)
Queshank
You've polled the world's philosophers on this question? Even with current technology that must have been a time consuming endeavor. But even stipulating that, it doesn't make any difference. Philosophies are just theories that can't be proved, so who cares what philosophers think? True, it does work for your purposes and it also works for anyone who disagrees with you. Just change what the "shadow" is. That's why it doesn't mean very much. I mostly look at it as more of a philosophical theory than a political one. It matters what kind of weirdo it is. Mocking women for not having children is stupid weirdo. |
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Post by queshank on Nov 7, 2024 6:27:31 GMT
Ahahaha I hat tipped you because I love it when you give scholarly and opinionated dissertations on this subject that half of the world's philosophers disagree with you on.
The allegory of the cave works for the purposes I use it for. The shadows on the wall being made by people are not reality. And that's all the allegory means when you're not trying to get published. Or ... whatever weirdo thing it is you're doing. (Did you ever think weirdo was a good insult? God the democrats are dumb. It's almost a term of fucking endearment in todays lexicon ffs)
Queshank
You've polled the world's philosophers on this question? Even with current technology that must have been a time consuming endeavor. But even stipulating that, it doesn't make any difference. Philosophies are just theories that can't be proved, so who cares what philosophers think? True, it does work for your purposes and it also works for anyone who disagrees with you. Just change what the "shadow" is. That's why it doesn't mean very much. I mostly look at it as more of a philosophical theory than a political one. It matters what kind of weirdo it is. Mocking women for not having children is stupid weirdo.
You're really overthinking it.
Queshank
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Post by queshank on Nov 8, 2024 18:37:38 GMT
About 7 years ago I started arguing with RL friends that Rachel Maddow is nothing but a conspiracy theorist. Pre 2016 I used to argue she was the Sean Hannity of the left. Post 2016 I argued she was the Alex Jones of the left.
No surprise she's gonna factor in to this. This is like the 8th person I've seen share this clip as an argument proving Trump stole the 2024 election.
Queshank
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Post by MojoJojo on Nov 8, 2024 19:28:28 GMT
Heh, my brother-in-law was echoing that sentiment last night (where are the votes? something is wrong here!)...my response was, the people are still here, they sat on their hands instead of voting. That happens when your choices don't motivate you enough to bother...that's part of democracy too.
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Post by queshank on Nov 8, 2024 19:51:52 GMT
Heh, my brother-in-law was echoing that sentiment last night (where are the votes? something is wrong here!)...my response was, the people are still here, they sat on their hands instead of voting. That happens when your choices don't motivate you enough to bother...that's part of democracy too.
The more important piece of the puzzle is that there are still millions of votes being counted in states like California.
People getting out over their skiis on this. And it's why all of my posts on this have been loling.
23 minutes ago, according to the NY Times, only 58% of California's vote is in.
That 58% is 10,600,000 votes. The 42% isn't insignificant. And there's a half dozen states out there in similar situations.
It's gonna look way less aberrant in the end.
Queshank
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Post by queshank on Nov 8, 2024 20:22:54 GMT
Another thing I'm finding wildly entertaining about this attempted narrative is how it puts this on display.
Dem votes
2008 69,498,516
2012 65,915,795
2016 65,856,514
2020 81,284,666
2024 69,243,108
Only one of those looks weird ....
Queshank
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Post by queshank on Nov 8, 2024 20:41:59 GMT
Contrasted with:
Rep votes
2008 59,948,323 2012 60,933,504 2016 62,984,828 2020 74,224,319 2024 73,579,778 and counting
How come there's no weird outliers?
Dun dun DUUUUUUN
Queshank
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stugatze
Legend
Posts: 9,248
Member is Online
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Post by stugatze on Nov 8, 2024 21:11:10 GMT
How much traction do you think this is gonna get? I'm a few hours late to the party but it seems to be popping up more frequently among randos.
Queshank
____________________________________________________________________________
That is NOT the right question to be asking:
You SHOULD ask, .. ''How was it that supposedly 155 million votes were cast in the 2020 election, .. and about HOW many MILLIONS of extra votes went to the democrat party? 
In years and years, in earlier elections in a row, .. NOT that many voters voted in such huge numbers, .. why in 2020? 
Could it be that many of those 18 million EXTRA votes, .. that about 7 million democrat votes were 'FICTIONAL'??
Biden .. was NOT ever a popular Presidential candidate, and could NOT ever get about 100 or so people to show up at any of his political rallies, yet, .. Trump received THOUSANDS and THOUSANDS of people who attended his rallies!
In addition, .. Biden had to DROP out of previous Presidential races EARLY because, he could NEVER get much support for his candidacy.
I find it rather odd how Joe Biden somehow managed to receive supposedly 81 million votes in 2020, .. which was 11 MILLION MORE VOTES than WHAT Barack Obama EVER received, .. and Obama was very very popular, .. but, Biden was NEVER as popular. 
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petep
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Post by petep on Nov 8, 2024 21:16:05 GMT
The allegory of the cave is always good for a few laughs. Ivory prisons and cave walls? Kind of a mixed metaphor. Whatever. I'm a reverse cave allegory guy. What are "shadows" to Plato is the everyday empirical world that most people know. I'll take that over his supposedly superior supernatural "forms." A very influential philosopher, but on occasion a silly twit. If nothing else it shows how little human nature has changed over thousands of years. |
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petep
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Post by petep on Nov 8, 2024 21:19:00 GMT
Contrasted with:
Rep votes
2008 59,948,323 2012 60,933,504 2016 62,984,828 2020 74,224,319 2024 73,579,778 and counting
How come there's no weird outliers?
Dun dun DUUUUUUN
Queshank
For anyone to state this is not at least extremely odd is dismissive. Especially when you add in the biden had the lowest enthusiasm rating among any running candidate and it was during covid when the left would not leave their homes. |
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Post by queshank on Nov 8, 2024 21:41:03 GMT
omg I almost spit out my mountain dew.
Check out that guy's bio.
Yeah Mr. Eric Garland. It's like ... 20 million votes just ... disappeared into the ether. Almost like they never existed to begin with.
Good god they don't even see what they're doing with this.
Queshank
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petep
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Post by petep on Nov 8, 2024 21:49:47 GMT
omg I almost spit out my mountain dew.
Check out that guy's bio.
Yeah Mr. Eric Garland. It's like ... 20 million votes just ... disappeared into the ether. Almost like they never existed to begin with.
Good god they don't even see what they're doing with this.
Queshank
Usually you will get - you have no proof - you conspiracy nut - there is no evidence of widespread, country wide, state by state, coordinated effort of voter fraud led by a central figure Let’s just focus on the future. |
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Post by HolyMoly on Nov 8, 2024 23:02:02 GMT
The allegory of the cave is always good for a few laughs. Ivory prisons and cave walls? Kind of a mixed metaphor. Whatever. I'm a reverse cave allegory guy. What are "shadows" to Plato is the everyday empirical world that most people know. I'll take that over his supposedly superior supernatural "forms." A very influential philosopher, but on occasion a silly twit. If nothing else it shows how little human nature has changed over thousands of years. Even if that is true, I don't think that was the main argument of the cave allegory. Hey, it's down to 12 million "disappearing" votes. |
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Post by queshank on Nov 9, 2024 1:56:56 GMT
Contrasted with:
Rep votes
2008 59,948,323 2012 60,933,504 2016 62,984,828 2020 74,224,319 2024 73,579,778 and counting
How come there's no weird outliers?
Dun dun DUUUUUUN
Queshank
The count is at 74,176,361 votes for Trump now! With 5% more of the vote counted in California .... 37% to go!
Things are looking bad for ... *checks notes* ... your math.
Queshank
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Post by queshank on Nov 9, 2024 2:36:19 GMT
If nothing else it shows how little human nature has changed over thousands of years. Even if that is true, I don't think that was the main argument of the cave allegory. Hey, it's down to 12 million "disappearing" votes.
That's a strange argument for you to make considering you regularly ignore what the main argument of the cave allegory was.
Yeah down to 12 million now. It'll continue to evaporate. But ... the narrative has been set. And that's the stuff I've spent 30+ years fascinated watching.
Queshank
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