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Post by RinsePrius on Sept 16, 2024 11:37:48 GMT
You think they're wrong, Rabbit? Forget the messenger for a moment. Run 20% tariffs and immigration reductions through your mind and tell me what you think is gonna happen to GDP? Don't have to be specific in terms of quantitative amounts, just a general direction of change will do! I'll side with Goldman and say the economy shrinks. The GDP is generally an awful metric that has tricked most Americans historically. Median real wages have been flat while GDP has skyrocketed for decades. I don’t think most Americans care if the GDP goes up if it means elites in DC, Wall Street, and Silicon Valley have bigger yachts. I think the Tea Party, Occupy Wall Street, Bernie Bros, and MAGA have all shared some of that same thread. I'll take that as a no. |
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Post by rabbitreborn on Sept 16, 2024 12:11:38 GMT
The GDP is generally an awful metric that has tricked most Americans historically. Median real wages have been flat while GDP has skyrocketed for decades. I don’t think most Americans care if the GDP goes up if it means elites in DC, Wall Street, and Silicon Valley have bigger yachts. I think the Tea Party, Occupy Wall Street, Bernie Bros, and MAGA have all shared some of that same thread. I'll take that as a no. I think tariffs generally are less favorable to GDP growth than a lack of tariffs. That’s a pretty easy question to answer. I also think GDP the way it is now (and has been for some time) defined is absurdly overvalued by the establishment, because it favors the establishment. I think policies can be enacted which increase GDP but are overall negative for a majority of Americans. So I guess I’m saying, and nothing I said in this thread could be construed otherwise, is that most people shouldn’t care what Goldman Sachs thinks about how a political metric should move in order to make Goldman Sachs better off. It’s like a king telling his people that “if we invade our neighbor, 100,000 of you will die. But in the end we will win and I will have more territory and more people under my control and I’ll have more gold in my palace. Your life will be more difficult in the short term and in the long run you’ll be no better off. Who’s with me?!?!” |
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thor
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Post by thor on Sept 16, 2024 12:44:34 GMT
The GDP is generally an awful metric that has tricked most Americans historically. Median real wages have been flat while GDP has skyrocketed for decades. I don’t think most Americans care if the GDP goes up if it means elites in DC, Wall Street, and Silicon Valley have bigger yachts. I think the Tea Party, Occupy Wall Street, Bernie Bros, and MAGA have all shared some of that same thread. I'll take that as a no. They still haven't gotten over you leaving. |
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Post by rabbitreborn on Sept 16, 2024 12:56:45 GMT
They still haven't gotten over you leaving. Thor. You know people can do searches on members’ previous posts, right? It’s you that hasn’t gotten over it. You bring it up constantly. Nobody else does. |
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Post by freonbale on Sept 16, 2024 15:08:24 GMT
I say we build one above us, to keep the aliens out. Freon
Who are these "aliens"?
Not who. What. Freon |
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Post by queshank on Sept 16, 2024 15:14:33 GMT
It's entirely relevant when someone argues that "the smartest people in the room" say something and therefore we should listen.
Sure I remember the farm bailouts. They were Trump buying off his voters in the same way Democrats try to buy off their own voters. (Insert discussion about student loan forgiveness here)
At least Trump's voter buyoff is cheaper. And goes to working folk not people with degrees in underwater basket weaving that suddenly can't find work to pay off their loans.
But I do notice you dodged "isn't it more complicated than that?"
Queshank
Nah, it really isn't relevant at all. It doesn't sound to me you remember the farm bailouts, which were specifically bailouts for failing companies. A buy off? Yes. But the difference between this bailout and student loan forgiveness is that tariff policy made it necessary from a macro-stability perspective. Of course that's not what you want to highlight here as someone defending economic irrationality.
RP says: "Smartest guys in the room say Kamala Better Than Trump on the Economy"
Queshank says: "Smartest guys in the room are pretty regularly wrong."
RP says: "That's not really relevant at all."
lol. You're a caricature of yourself.
Queshank
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Post by queshank on Sept 16, 2024 15:15:23 GMT
Holy shit are you really this dumb? Or are you just tryin to dig deep for a "laugh?"
We are discussing the credibility of your sources. Are you really unable to see that?
Queshank
Oh I saw it I just thought it was a dumb response.
Yeah. Questioning the integrity, morals, ethics and motivations of Goldman Sachs is sO sTuPiD!!11
You've really fallen hook line and sinker haven't you?
Queshank
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Post by queshank on Sept 16, 2024 15:17:13 GMT
They still haven't gotten over you leaving.
Who is they?
You know I have spent literally every moment of my time on LNF arguing with TL's deluded positions right? Since his very first post here on the boards?
Where did he leave? He just traded one deluded cult for another.
You act as if people who make dumb arguments like RP has been wouldn't be responded to in similar fashion. Every post you make is an argument to the contrary, no? No. You don't have arguments lol. You're the new Bert.
Queshank
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thor
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Post by thor on Sept 16, 2024 18:50:03 GMT
They still haven't gotten over you leaving. Thor. You know people can do searches on members’ previous posts, right? It’s you that hasn’t gotten over it. You bring it up constantly. Nobody else does. Ah.....  Pro defense, Fobbit! |
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Odysseus
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Trump = Disaster
Posts: 41,115
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Post by Odysseus on Sept 16, 2024 19:09:34 GMT
OK.
What are these aliens?
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Post by johnnybgood on Sept 16, 2024 19:16:34 GMT
No, one up north to keep those damn Canadians out. I say we build one above us, to keep the aliens out. Freon Illegal Aliens |
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Post by freonbale on Sept 16, 2024 23:01:17 GMT
OK.
What are these aliens?
Sentient life who have traveled here from another planet. Freon |
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Odysseus
Legend
Trump = Disaster
Posts: 41,115
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Post by Odysseus on Sept 16, 2024 23:57:50 GMT
OK.
What are these aliens?
Sentient life who have traveled here from another planet. Freon
Do you believe such life exists?
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Post by freonbale on Sept 17, 2024 0:20:05 GMT
Sentient life who have traveled here from another planet. Freon
Do you believe such life exists?
Do I believe life exists outside of Earth. 100% confident. Do I believe there is sentient life in the universe besides us? 99% confident. Do I believe that sentient life has discovered Earth? 1% confident. Do I believe that it not only has discovered us, but visited us? 0.000001% confident. And that's why we need a sky wall! Freon |
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Post by archie on Sept 17, 2024 0:46:01 GMT
The smartest guys in the room just pointed out the obvious, that Kamala and the Democrats have better ideas for boosting economic growth than the MAGA GOP. www.reuters.com/world/us/goldman-sachs-sees-biggest-boost-us-economy-harris-win-2024-09-04/Democratic administrations have a history of outperforming GOP when it comes to economic outcomes. Now that the GOP has embraced economic stupidity, expect this trend to continue if not hasten. There's a real tragedy here from a conservative political point of view. We've lived through a period of historic inflation. The GOP should be able to exploit the opportunity and paint themselves as saviors. But their own ideas are so bad the whole opportunity is lost. Simple question. “Was the economy, better under Trump, or after Biden took over?” Harris and Biden have been in power for the last almost four years. How is it going? |
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Post by RinsePrius on Sept 22, 2024 14:03:12 GMT
I think tariffs generally are less favorable to GDP growth than a lack of tariffs. That’s a pretty easy question to answer. I also think GDP the way it is now (and has been for some time) defined is absurdly overvalued by the establishment, because it favors the establishment. I think policies can be enacted which increase GDP but are overall negative for a majority of Americans. So I guess I’m saying, and nothing I said in this thread could be construed otherwise, is that most people shouldn’t care what Goldman Sachs thinks about how a political metric should move in order to make Goldman Sachs better off. It’s like a king telling his people that “if we invade our neighbor, 100,000 of you will die. But in the end we will win and I will have more territory and more people under my control and I’ll have more gold in my palace. Your life will be more difficult in the short term and in the long run you’ll be no better off. Who’s with me?!?!” I think our definition of GDP is probably not perfect but does capture something about how people are living and that we are *all* better off when the economy is expanding rather than contracting, notwithstanding whatever disagreements people might have over how that measurement is quantified. This is one of those issues that really is about the common good. Tariffs aren't just going to impact Goldman, they will impact us all and for the worse. I know you know that, probably as well as I do. |
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petep
Legend
Posts: 26,028
Member is Online
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Post by petep on Sept 22, 2024 14:04:51 GMT
The smartest guys in the room just pointed out the obvious, that Kamala and the Democrats have better ideas for boosting economic growth than the MAGA GOP. www.reuters.com/world/us/goldman-sachs-sees-biggest-boost-us-economy-harris-win-2024-09-04/Democratic administrations have a history of outperforming GOP when it comes to economic outcomes. Now that the GOP has embraced economic stupidity, expect this trend to continue if not hasten. There's a real tragedy here from a conservative political point of view. We've lived through a period of historic inflation. The GOP should be able to exploit the opportunity and paint themselves as saviors. But their own ideas are so bad the whole opportunity is lost. Didn’t they pay Hillary 800k for her investing advice. I’d also root for the puppet I can control |
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Post by RinsePrius on Sept 22, 2024 14:06:28 GMT
Nah, it really isn't relevant at all. It doesn't sound to me you remember the farm bailouts, which were specifically bailouts for failing companies. A buy off? Yes. But the difference between this bailout and student loan forgiveness is that tariff policy made it necessary from a macro-stability perspective. Of course that's not what you want to highlight here as someone defending economic irrationality.
RP says: "Smartest guys in the room say Kamala Better Than Trump on the Economy"
Queshank says: "Smartest guys in the room are pretty regularly wrong."
RP says: "That's not really relevant at all."
lol. You're a caricature of yourself.
Queshank
People in general are regularly wrong. My off-hand comment tells us nothing about their call, whether its right or wrong. You're trying to take the subject off Goldman and onto my choice of words- something that tells us nothing about the question at hand - is Goldman right? |
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Post by RinsePrius on Sept 22, 2024 14:07:24 GMT
Oh I saw it I just thought it was a dumb response.
Yeah. Questioning the integrity, morals, ethics and motivations of Goldman Sachs is sO sTuPiD!!11
You've really fallen hook line and sinker haven't you?
Queshank
You didn't do that, you questioned my choice of words. If you want to shoot the messenger, that's fine, but it doesn't get us any close to rendering a verdict on tariffs and their impact. |
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Post by RinsePrius on Sept 22, 2024 14:09:48 GMT
The smartest guys in the room just pointed out the obvious, that Kamala and the Democrats have better ideas for boosting economic growth than the MAGA GOP. www.reuters.com/world/us/goldman-sachs-sees-biggest-boost-us-economy-harris-win-2024-09-04/Democratic administrations have a history of outperforming GOP when it comes to economic outcomes. Now that the GOP has embraced economic stupidity, expect this trend to continue if not hasten. There's a real tragedy here from a conservative political point of view. We've lived through a period of historic inflation. The GOP should be able to exploit the opportunity and paint themselves as saviors. But their own ideas are so bad the whole opportunity is lost. Simple question. “Was the economy, better under Trump, or after Biden took over?” Harris and Biden have been in power for the last almost four years. How is it going? Better than it started. Employment is up, the stock market is near an all time high, inflation has been conquered, energy output is setting new records, and as financial conditions loosen an expansion is on the table. |
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