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Post by Mercy for All on Apr 5, 2024 14:48:33 GMT
You have an unprovable foundational belief that posting here will: - Be seen and read (and understood, for that matter)
- Be engaged with (unless you are presuming to have the last word on the matter)
- Make some kind of difference or have some kind of impact.
Else, why do it?
"Faith" does not mean "unprovable/irrational belief in the supernatural."
I'm pretty sure that the U.S. Marines don't go into battle under the mantra of "maintain an irrational belief in the supernatural" (semper fi).
Everybody has faith. Without it, you wouldn't get up in the morning, or eat, or get an education, or read a book, or pursue a career, or buy a house...or post something on an online forum. Faith is a commitment demonstrated by a course of action—an allegiance to a person or ideal. The concept is not "inherently religious"; that's an erroneous Enlightenment construct that posited "faith" against "reason." I strongly disagree with all this.
Why do I post here. Because it amuses me and it's a distraction.
There is a small chance that this could be some kind of deception, but if so then it's a very good one and if it is a deception and no one sees my posting then what of it? I have lost nothing and got the same amount of distraction, nothing's changed about that, of course if it is a deception and I find out, I am gonna stop posting because I need that at least as a possibility to be motivated. No faith here.
You know you could argue solipsism if you will and it would be basically the same as what you are doing...It's always a possibility and if so then what? What have I lost?
You don't need the thing you call faith to be alive and well and to do whatever you want to do.
Why would it amuse you to post here? If nobody read your posts, or would respond, would you post here? If every other poster was a bot rather than a real person, would you post here? Would it still amuse you?
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Post by Mercy for All on Apr 5, 2024 14:49:27 GMT
Having evidence is not the same as "knowing." Evidence contributes to knowing, but does not guarantee that confidence. You have faith in your spouse. Based on evidence. Hopefully the confidence in that evidence is justified. But to presume that all religious belief is based on no evidence whatsoever is to deny the experience of billions. Because people do not hold to religious belief blindly. If you really think that's the case, I would encourage you to talk to some religious people in real life and ask them why they believe what they believe. Its not just experience. 1/3 of the worlds population is not Christian because they woke up one day and decided they would spin the random wheel on what to believe. We have The Bible, History, Culture, and Archeology. Doesn't "prove" it all, but it is certainly evidence and compelling enough for a lot of people. It's absolutely not "just experience." But if someone were to actually go through the steps to find out why people believe, they might just discover that.
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Hospital
Apr 5, 2024 16:45:53 GMT
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Post by DaveJavu on Apr 5, 2024 16:45:53 GMT
I strongly disagree with all this.
Why do I post here. Because it amuses me and it's a distraction.
There is a small chance that this could be some kind of deception, but if so then it's a very good one and if it is a deception and no one sees my posting then what of it? I have lost nothing and got the same amount of distraction, nothing's changed about that, of course if it is a deception and I find out, I am gonna stop posting because I need that at least as a possibility to be motivated. No faith here.
You know you could argue solipsism if you will and it would be basically the same as what you are doing...It's always a possibility and if so then what? What have I lost?
You don't need the thing you call faith to be alive and well and to do whatever you want to do.
Why would it amuse you to post here? If nobody read your posts, or would respond, would you post here? If every other poster was a bot rather than a real person, would you post here? Would it still amuse you? Every poster may not be a bot but there is a real chance that some of them could be lying about what they are. So what? I don't know the people here (with one exception), most of them I think are truthful but what if they are not? Would it change anything to my life? No. If I knew for s fact that this is entirely simulated, well for one thing, I'd be very interested as to its purpose and sure I would stop posting but otherwise I would mostly take it in stride. My life doesn't revolve around the reality of this site.
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Post by Mercy for All on Apr 5, 2024 16:49:21 GMT
Why would it amuse you to post here? If nobody read your posts, or would respond, would you post here? If every other poster was a bot rather than a real person, would you post here? Would it still amuse you? Every poster may not be a bot but there is a real chance that some of them could be lying about what they are. So what? I don't know the people here (with one exception), most of them I think are truthful but what if they are not? Would it change anything to my life? No. If I knew for s fact that this is entirely simulated, well for one thing, I'd be very interested as to its purpose and sure I would stop posting but otherwise I would mostly take it in stride. My life doesn't revolve around the reality of this site. Not the point. You post here out of an unproven assumption that people will read your post. And hopefully respond. And that it's worthwhile (in some way) for you to do it). I'm not saying it's unreasonable to do so. Or even to hold those assumptions. Because "faith" is not the opposite of "reason."
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petep
Legend
Posts: 23,419
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Hospital
Apr 5, 2024 17:10:10 GMT
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Post by petep on Apr 5, 2024 17:10:10 GMT
Every poster may not be a bot but there is a real chance that some of them could be lying about what they are. So what? I don't know the people here (with one exception), most of them I think are truthful but what if they are not? Would it change anything to my life? No. If I knew for s fact that this is entirely simulated, well for one thing, I'd be very interested as to its purpose and sure I would stop posting but otherwise I would mostly take it in stride. My life doesn't revolve around the reality of this site. Not the point. You post here out of an unproven assumption that people will read your post. And hopefully respond. And that it's worthwhile (in some way) for you to do it). I'm not saying it's unreasonable to do so. Or even to hold those assumptions. Because "faith" is not the opposite of "reason." I wonder at times how many would actually meet others on this forum. I’ve spent a night out with limey. He met my wife. Knows my LinkedIn page. Knows my name. Has my email, cell etc. I’d have no issues with meeting Greg if he were down this way. I think once I told of of an event I was attending in Rhode Island I thought he might find fun. Much of what’s posted on forums - or some - is an exaggeration of views. I wonder if all the southern cal people here would get together. Or perhaps people come here strictly to be anonymous. Either way is obviously fine.
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Post by DaveJavu on Apr 5, 2024 17:33:47 GMT
Every poster may not be a bot but there is a real chance that some of them could be lying about what they are. So what? I don't know the people here (with one exception), most of them I think are truthful but what if they are not? Would it change anything to my life? No. If I knew for s fact that this is entirely simulated, well for one thing, I'd be very interested as to its purpose and sure I would stop posting but otherwise I would mostly take it in stride. My life doesn't revolve around the reality of this site. Not the point. You post here out of an unproven assumption that people will read your post. And hopefully respond. And that it's worthwhile (in some way) for you to do it). I'm not saying it's unreasonable to do so. Or even to hold those assumptions. Because "faith" is not the opposite of "reason." I disagree. You don't need "faith" to post here. You go to the movies, yet you know everything is fake, the villain could be the kindest person you've ever met, the hero a coward, the genius doesn't know the first thing about what he's supposed to be a genius about... Did you know that in "Goldfinger", the actor who played the eponymous role didn't know a word of English? Still, the man is so good that you can't tell. As I said, everything is fake yet you still go to the movies and you're still sad when something happens to the good guy. No need for faith here.
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Post by Mercy for All on Apr 5, 2024 18:30:15 GMT
Not the point. You post here out of an unproven assumption that people will read your post. And hopefully respond. And that it's worthwhile (in some way) for you to do it). I'm not saying it's unreasonable to do so. Or even to hold those assumptions. Because "faith" is not the opposite of "reason." I disagree. You don't need "faith" to post here. You go to the movies, yet you know everything is fake, the villain could be the kindest person you've ever met, the hero a coward, the genius doesn't know the first thing about what he's supposed to be a genius about... Did you know that in "Goldfinger", the actor who played the eponymous role didn't know a word of English? Still, the man is so good that you can't tell. As I said, everything is fake yet you still go to the movies and you're still sad when something happens to the good guy. No need for faith here. You still misunderstand. You buy a movie ticket anticipating that a movie will actually show. You buy a ticket in faith that the movie will be worth seeing. Where did I say anything about "believing a fiction"? Faith is demonstrated in any act based on the anticipation that something will happen. People pursue scientific knowledge not just "for something to do," but in the faith that the process will reveal knowledge—and that knowledge is worth pursuing, and that the universe follows consistent laws, and that it is actually possible to understand and use the knowledge gained through the process. All of that is "faith." None of those things are "provable from first principles."
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Post by Mercy for All on Apr 5, 2024 18:31:38 GMT
Not the point. You post here out of an unproven assumption that people will read your post. And hopefully respond. And that it's worthwhile (in some way) for you to do it). I'm not saying it's unreasonable to do so. Or even to hold those assumptions. Because "faith" is not the opposite of "reason." I wonder at times how many would actually meet others on this forum. I’ve spent a night out with limey. He met my wife. Knows my LinkedIn page. Knows my name. Has my email, cell etc. I’d have no issues with meeting Greg if he were down this way. I think once I told of of an event I was attending in Rhode Island I thought he might find fun. Much of what’s posted on forums - or some - is an exaggeration of views. I wonder if all the southern cal people here would get together. Or perhaps people come here strictly to be anonymous. Either way is obviously fine. My list has gotten shorter. I've met three old LNFers in real life. All of them from way back. As for personal info, other than the three I met in person, I've shared personal info with four others, one of whom has passed on. EDIT: I don't know if he remembers, but I have a long-standing agreement to look up limey 2, if and when I ever make it over the pond.
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Post by DaveJavu on Apr 5, 2024 19:47:51 GMT
I disagree. You don't need "faith" to post here. You go to the movies, yet you know everything is fake, the villain could be the kindest person you've ever met, the hero a coward, the genius doesn't know the first thing about what he's supposed to be a genius about... Did you know that in "Goldfinger", the actor who played the eponymous role didn't know a word of English? Still, the man is so good that you can't tell. As I said, everything is fake yet you still go to the movies and you're still sad when something happens to the good guy. No need for faith here. You still misunderstand. You buy a movie ticket anticipating that a movie will actually show. You buy a ticket in faith that the movie will be worth seeing. Where did I say anything about "believing a fiction"? Faith is demonstrated in any act based on the anticipation that something will happen. People pursue scientific knowledge not just "for something to do," but in the faith that the process will reveal knowledge—and that knowledge is worth pursuing, and that the universe follows consistent laws, and that it is actually possible to understand and use the knowledge gained through the process. All of that is "faith." None of those things are "provable from first principles." Do you ever put a blindfold on and cross a highway? Why? Because you know it's too risky for one thing. Where is your "faith"? Nowhere to be seen. You live in a self-induced delusional state in which "faith" is a real thing when in fact the thing you call "faith" doesn't exist. What makes us do things is in essence the same thing that makes an ameba, a lizard, a dog or an ape do things. We exist, we have needs, wants and we know that we have to do something, even inaction is doing something in that case, so we choose (In our opinion, based on our mental capabilities, our experience, our fears...) the course of action that will most likely get us the outcome we want. And we do so each time there is a new thing that we need or want. And don't tell me there is faith there unless you are going to argue that a blade of grass has faith.
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Post by Mercy for All on Apr 5, 2024 19:59:01 GMT
You still misunderstand. You buy a movie ticket anticipating that a movie will actually show. You buy a ticket in faith that the movie will be worth seeing. Where did I say anything about "believing a fiction"? Faith is demonstrated in any act based on the anticipation that something will happen. People pursue scientific knowledge not just "for something to do," but in the faith that the process will reveal knowledge—and that knowledge is worth pursuing, and that the universe follows consistent laws, and that it is actually possible to understand and use the knowledge gained through the process. All of that is "faith." None of those things are "provable from first principles." Do you ever put a blindfold on and cross a highway? Why? Because you know it's too risky for one thing. Where is your "faith"? Nowhere to be seen. You live in a self-induced delusional state in which "faith" is a real thing when in fact the thing you call "faith" doesn't exist. What makes us do things is in essence the same thing that makes an ameba, a lizard, a dog or an ape do things. We exist, we have needs, wants and we know that we have to do something, even inaction is doing something in that case, so we choose (In our opinion, based on our mental capabilities, our experience, our fears...) the course of action that will most likely get us the outcome we want. And we do so each time there is a new thing that we need or want. And don't tell me there is faith there unless you are going to argue that a blade of grass has faith. I think there's a language barrier here. "Faith" is not implicitly religious. I mentioned before that the U.S. Marines motto (s emper fi) does not mean "cling to spiritual beliefs" or whatever. There is no act of will without faith...without the belief in the efficacy of the action and its results.
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Post by DaveJavu on Apr 5, 2024 20:08:31 GMT
Do you ever put a blindfold on and cross a highway? Why? Because you know it's too risky for one thing. Where is your "faith"? Nowhere to be seen. You live in a self-induced delusional state in which "faith" is a real thing when in fact the thing you call "faith" doesn't exist. What makes us do things is in essence the same thing that makes an ameba, a lizard, a dog or an ape do things. We exist, we have needs, wants and we know that we have to do something, even inaction is doing something in that case, so we choose (In our opinion, based on our mental capabilities, our experience, our fears...) the course of action that will most likely get us the outcome we want. And we do so each time there is a new thing that we need or want. And don't tell me there is faith there unless you are going to argue that a blade of grass has faith. I think there's a language barrier here*. "Faith" is not implicitly religious. I mentioned before that the U.S. Marines motto (s emper fi) does not mean "cling to spiritual beliefs" or whatever. There is no act of will without faith...without the belief in the efficacy of the action and its results. So you believe a protozoa, a coelacanth, a praying mantis, have faith? Interesting... * and please, don't patronize me.
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Odysseus
Legend
Trump=Chump
Posts: 39,224
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Post by Odysseus on Apr 5, 2024 20:20:53 GMT
Back to the thread topic: I wonder how Limey is doing now...
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Post by limey² on Apr 5, 2024 20:39:26 GMT
I wonder at times how many would actually meet others on this forum. I’ve spent a night out with limey. He met my wife. Knows my LinkedIn page. Knows my name. Has my email, cell etc. I’d have no issues with meeting Greg if he were down this way. I think once I told of of an event I was attending in Rhode Island I thought he might find fun. Much of what’s posted on forums - or some - is an exaggeration of views. I wonder if all the southern cal people here would get together. Or perhaps people come here strictly to be anonymous. Either way is obviously fine. My list has gotten shorter. I've met three old LNFers in real life. All of them from way back. As for personal info, other than the three I met in person, I've shared personal info with four others, one of whom has passed on. EDIT: I don't know if he remembers, but I have a long-standing agreement to look up limey 2, if and when I ever make it over the pond. I've been waiting at the airport. Cost me a fucking fortune in car parking.
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Post by Mercy for All on Apr 5, 2024 20:48:15 GMT
I think there's a language barrier here*. "Faith" is not implicitly religious. I mentioned before that the U.S. Marines motto (s emper fi) does not mean "cling to spiritual beliefs" or whatever. There is no act of will without faith...without the belief in the efficacy of the action and its results. So you believe a protozoa, a coelacanth, a praying mantis, have faith? Interesting... * and please, don't patronize me. Do they have will?
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Post by Mercy for All on Apr 5, 2024 20:48:47 GMT
My list has gotten shorter. I've met three old LNFers in real life. All of them from way back. As for personal info, other than the three I met in person, I've shared personal info with four others, one of whom has passed on. EDIT: I don't know if he remembers, but I have a long-standing agreement to look up limey 2, if and when I ever make it over the pond. I've been waiting at the airport. Cost me a fucking fortune in car parking. What if I were coming by boat?
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Hospital
Apr 5, 2024 20:54:49 GMT
via mobile
Post by limey² on Apr 5, 2024 20:54:49 GMT
I've been waiting at the airport. Cost me a fucking fortune in car parking. What if I were coming by boat? I mined the sea lanes.
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Post by HolyMoly on Apr 5, 2024 20:58:37 GMT
I'm guessing the ark must have stunk to high heaven after a few days with all the animal waste. PU. I hear they only found terra firma after one year of floating around. What did they feed the tigers? Carrots? There are a number of practical considerations that make Noah's Ark look like a leg pull, though an entertaining one. How did the old guy make sure that the two ants didn't leave the ark before he "weighed anchor." Whatever.
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Post by HolyMoly on Apr 5, 2024 21:01:12 GMT
I always figured that as a general rule the earlier parts of the Bible are less accurate than the later parts.
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Post by DaveJavu on Apr 5, 2024 21:09:24 GMT
So you believe a protozoa, a coelacanth, a praying mantis, have faith? Interesting... * and please, don't patronize me. Do they have will?I don't know but the point is that they can act without "faith", whatever you want it to mean, so why couldn't we? You seem to be arguing that we are more limited than animals much lower on the food-chain.
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Post by DaveJavu on Apr 5, 2024 21:11:17 GMT
I always figured that as a general rule the earlier parts of the Bible are less accurate than the later parts. "more inaccurate" is more like it.
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