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Post by Mercy for All on Mar 4, 2022 0:40:29 GMT
How do you know this? I grew up with the definition of "faith" as some kind of wishful thinking or willful suppression of doubt. My understanding has changed drastically. It seems you have placed a fair bit of faith in your ill-founded presumptions. On the contrary. I have offered a definition. You have not. Absolutely. Bully for you. Again, bully for you. The problem is that the words we use are not subject to arbitrary, individualized, esoteric definitions. If you want to redefine faith to make it mean what you want to mean, you're better off coining a new word to avoid confusion. Because the word "faith" has a definition already—as I have defined it. Bully for you again. It's always somewhat amusing when someone justifies their offensive condescension with "no offence, but..." In the words of the man in black, "Truly you have a dizzying intellect." But not so much that you can make yourself understood. It doesn't take pages and pages to define the word. It already has a definition. Sometimes people do not offer their dissent because it's not worth their time and effort. Oh, but it does. That is quite clear. It's not that complicated. Overcomplicating something is not an indication of intelligence. I don't think you can make the argument that my explanation is MORE complicated than yours. Faith is a choice. Four little words of tremendous power and significance. Can't be much simpler than that.
Your definition does not seem transferrable, teachable, or implementable.
How then, is your definition practical? I'm simply saying that since it isn't practical, it is not a good definition. With mine, you can implement it right here and now, at this moment, and it applies to all religions and beliefs that are unsupported by physical phenomena.
Freon
If faith is choice, what is the distinction between faith and choice, if any? |
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Post by freonbale on Mar 4, 2022 2:12:06 GMT
I don't think you can make the argument that my explanation is MORE complicated than yours. Faith is a choice. Four little words of tremendous power and significance. Can't be much simpler than that.
Your definition does not seem transferrable, teachable, or implementable.
How then, is your definition practical? I'm simply saying that since it isn't practical, it is not a good definition. With mine, you can implement it right here and now, at this moment, and it applies to all religions and beliefs that are unsupported by physical phenomena.
Freon
If faith is choice, what is the distinction between faith and choice, if any? Faith is the choice to believe in something that cannot be proven. It MUST not be proven. Even the attempt to prove, misses the point of Faith entirely, negates it's power completely. If there is no leap, there is no benefit.
Freon
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2022 13:02:17 GMT
If faith is choice, what is the distinction between faith and choice, if any? Faith is the choice to believe in something that cannot be proven. It MUST not be proven. Even the attempt to prove, misses the point of Faith entirely, negates it's power completely. If there is no leap, there is no benefit.
Freon
You talk about being an idiot like it's a good thing. Take that guy who had faith that if he entered the lion's den at the zoo (because he believed that god wouldn't let the lion hurt him) the lion would leave him alone. So what does he do? He enters the den and the lion kills him. People choose to be stupid and they feel good about it as long as it doesn't make them do things that will get them (or worse yet others) hurt or killed, it's just a stupid belief without consequences, as soon as they do something based on that faith, hey're just playing russian roulette without knowing it. It's despicable. Most people have in them the aptitude to act reasonably but some (many alas) choose to act stupidly , potentially destructively and when they are not punished for it they try to pass that bug onto fragile and influential people... What a waste! |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2022 13:09:16 GMT
I don't think you can make the argument that my explanation is MORE complicated than yours. Faith is a choice. Four little words of tremendous power and significance. Can't be much simpler than that.
Your definition does not seem transferrable, teachable, or implementable.
How then, is your definition practical? I'm simply saying that since it isn't practical, it is not a good definition. With mine, you can implement it right here and now, at this moment, and it applies to all religions and beliefs that are unsupported by physical phenomena.
Freon
If faith is choice, what is the distinction between faith and choice, if any? The distinction is that these are two different words with two different meanings, dummy! |
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Post by Mercy for All on Mar 4, 2022 21:03:49 GMT
If faith is choice, what is the distinction between faith and choice, if any? Faith is the choice to believe in something that cannot be proven. It MUST not be proven. Even the attempt to prove, misses the point of Faith entirely, negates it's power completely. If there is no leap, there is no benefit.
Freon
Are you arguing that as a definition of faith? The "choice to believe in something that cannot be proven"? By "proven" do you mean, "for which there is no, or could be no, evidence"? |
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Post by freonbale on Mar 4, 2022 22:49:09 GMT
Faith is the choice to believe in something that cannot be proven. It MUST not be proven. Even the attempt to prove, misses the point of Faith entirely, negates it's power completely. If there is no leap, there is no benefit.
Freon
Are you arguing that as a definition of faith? The "choice to believe in something that cannot be proven"? By "proven" do you mean, "for which there is no, or could be no, evidence"? Yes, exactly.
Freon
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Post by Mercy for All on Mar 5, 2022 16:56:21 GMT
Are you arguing that as a definition of faith? The "choice to believe in something that cannot be proven"? By "proven" do you mean, "for which there is no, or could be no, evidence"? Yes, exactly.
Freon
What happens when you have faith in something, and unexpectedly evidence appears? |
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Post by freonbale on Mar 5, 2022 23:19:31 GMT
What happens when you have faith in something, and unexpectedly evidence appears? Then it is no longer Faith, it is belief. The benefits of Faith are then not being practiced, and like any skill, they will fade.
Freon
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Post by Mercy for All on Mar 7, 2022 18:31:53 GMT
What happens when you have faith in something, and unexpectedly evidence appears? Then it is no longer Faith, it is belief. The benefits of Faith are then not being practiced, and like any skill, they will fade.
Freon
To appeal to your definition, it was never faith, because to qualify as faith, it has to be in something that cannot be proven (although what "it" is has yet to be clarified). |
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Post by freonbale on Mar 7, 2022 18:36:05 GMT
Then it is no longer Faith, it is belief. The benefits of Faith are then not being practiced, and like any skill, they will fade.
Freon
To appeal to your definition, it was never faith, because to qualify as faith, it has to be in something that cannot be proven (although what "it" is has yet to be clarified). If it was based on evidence, than I agree. 'It' is clear. Belief without proof, regardless in what (I am assuming I do not have to be specific that we are discussing existential beliefs, correct? I assume you realize we are having a conversation about belief in G-d, or some other larger issue, and not Cheese People from the Moon). Freon |
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