bama beau
Legend
Fish will piss anywhere. They just live in water.
Posts: 11,579
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Post by bama beau on Mar 10, 2021 7:07:14 GMT
Instantaneous creation of something from nothing,
that something being no less than all energy, matter,
being, space and time. To our perspective, everything.
And also, to our perspective, eternal. Whatever it is, it was
here when we got here, and it will be here when we're all gone.
Am I describing the Big Bang or Creation? Or both?
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Post by Mercy for All on Mar 11, 2021 2:11:06 GMT
Yup. Could be either. Or both.
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bama beau
Legend
Fish will piss anywhere. They just live in water.
Posts: 11,579
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Post by bama beau on Mar 12, 2021 5:51:25 GMT
Yup. Could be either. Or both. What I love most about the concept of the Universal creating Itself is that It is creating Space for Itself into which It can then expand, bringing Energy, Matter and Time along with It. And all out of what? Itself? |
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Post by Mercy for All on Mar 12, 2021 20:36:10 GMT
Yup. Could be either. Or both. What I love most about the concept of the Universal creating Itself is that It is creating Space for Itself into which It can then expand, bringing Energy, Matter and Time along with It. And all out of what? Itself? So...you're a pantheist? Panentheist? |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Mar 14, 2021 21:54:14 GMT
What I love most about the concept of the Universal creating Itself is that It is creating Space for Itself into which It can then expand, bringing Energy, Matter and Time along with It. And all out of what? Itself? So...you're a pantheist? Panentheist? Subdivisions of a larger group, the bullshittytheists... AKA "things someone once pulled out of one's ass"... theists.... |
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Post by atreyu on Mar 22, 2021 23:23:44 GMT
Yup. Could be either. Or both. What I love most about the concept of the Universal creating Itself is that It is creating Space for Itself into which It can then expand, bringing Energy, Matter and Time along with It. And all out of what? Itself?
It's actually impossible for nothing to exist. If you try to create a space with nothing in it particles will pop into existence. Nothing literally takes more energy to exist than for something to exist.
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Post by Mercy for All on Mar 22, 2021 23:46:14 GMT
What I love most about the concept of the Universal creating Itself is that It is creating Space for Itself into which It can then expand, bringing Energy, Matter and Time along with It. And all out of what? Itself?
It's actually impossible for nothing to exist. If you try to create a space with nothing in it particles will pop into existence. Nothing literally takes more energy to exist than for something to exist.
Why should things be that way? |
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Post by atreyu on Mar 22, 2021 23:51:33 GMT
It's actually impossible for nothing to exist. If you try to create a space with nothing in it particles will pop into existence. Nothing literally takes more energy to exist than for something to exist.
Why should things be that way?
Because if it were any other way we wouldn't be here to ask the question.
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Post by Mercy for All on Mar 22, 2021 23:58:42 GMT
Why should things be that way?
Because if it were any other way we wouldn't be here to ask the question.
That's where the scientific inquiry stops? "That's just the way it is"? Seems when someone says, "God created it," the statement is met with ridicule. But "that's just the way it is" isn't. Consider that M-Theory ("superstring theories") are leveraged to suggest that God "is not necessary" because "universes emerge" (because "nothing doesn't exist" - vertical particles, quantum fluctuations, etc.), but all that does is push the question back...instead of "why does this universe exist," the question becomes, "why does this entire system exist that should naturally produce universes?" And the answer is just..."because that's just the way it is"? Because, "if it were any other way we wouldn't be here to ask the question"? That's not really "an answer." That's not a reason. It's a description of the situation. |
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Post by atreyu on Mar 23, 2021 0:22:03 GMT
Because if it were any other way we wouldn't be here to ask the question.
That's where the scientific inquiry stops? "That's just the way it is"? Seems when someone says, "God created it," the statement is met with ridicule. But "that's just the way it is" isn't. Consider that M-Theory ("superstring theories") are leveraged to suggest that God "is not necessary" because "universes emerge" (because "nothing doesn't exist" - vertical particles, quantum fluctuations, etc.), but all that does is push the question back...instead of "why does this universe exist," the question becomes, "why does this entire system exist that should naturally produce universes?" And the answer is just..."because that's just the way it is"? Because, "if it were any other way we wouldn't be here to ask the question"? That's not really "an answer." That's not a reason. It's a description of the situation.
Oh heck no, that's not where the inquiry stops. We still need to understand why. Inserting "because god" is what limits further understanding. Pushing the question back is progress! If everyone accepted "because god" we would not to be at the point of understanding we currently have.
If you prefer we can say, we don't know the answer yet! Which is awesome!
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Post by Mercy for All on Mar 23, 2021 0:25:52 GMT
That's where the scientific inquiry stops? "That's just the way it is"? Seems when someone says, "God created it," the statement is met with ridicule. But "that's just the way it is" isn't. Consider that M-Theory ("superstring theories") are leveraged to suggest that God "is not necessary" because "universes emerge" (because "nothing doesn't exist" - vertical particles, quantum fluctuations, etc.), but all that does is push the question back...instead of "why does this universe exist," the question becomes, "why does this entire system exist that should naturally produce universes?" And the answer is just..."because that's just the way it is"? Because, "if it were any other way we wouldn't be here to ask the question"? That's not really "an answer." That's not a reason. It's a description of the situation.
Oh heck no, that's not where the inquiry stops. We still need to understand why. Inserting "because god" is what limits further understanding. Pushing the question back is progress! If everyone accepted "because god" we would not to be at the point of understanding we currently have.
If you prefer we can say, we don't know the answer yet! Which is awesome!
Oh, okay. To me, suggesting that "God did this..." only begins new lines of questions. It certainly doesn't limit the "how" questions (despite the claims of some). But to say, "If it were any other way we wouldn't be here to ask the question" seems to me to curtail further enquiry. Because it's a dead-end explanation that does not lead to further "how" or "why" questions. |
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Post by atreyu on Mar 23, 2021 0:31:27 GMT
Oh heck no, that's not where the inquiry stops. We still need to understand why. Inserting "because god" is what limits further understanding. Pushing the question back is progress! If everyone accepted "because god" we would not to be at the point of understanding we currently have.
If you prefer we can say, we don't know the answer yet! Which is awesome!
Oh, okay. To me, suggesting that "God did this..." only begins new lines of questions. It certainly doesn't limit the "how" questions (despite the claims of some). But to say, "If it were any other way we wouldn't be here to ask the question" seems to me to curtail further enquiry. Because it's a dead-end explanation that does not lead to further "how" or "why" questions.
Agreed, and I think it's because I misunderstood exactly what your question meant, so that's my bad.
At some point that actually may be the answer, it for example could be proven that constants in different places of the universe take on different values, and why things behave the way they do may be up to some level of chance. In some of those cases life may not be possible. So in essence, when we ask why it's that way, it may truly be because we are here and can ask that question while also having an understanding of why probability makes it possible.
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